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12-03-15 06:54PM |
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Phil_D
Drawmaster
Registered: May 2014
Location: Joliet, IL
Posts: 629 |
quote: Originally posted by biterbar
I see Ryan Brunt has left the program and Team Fenson after accepting new employment. Colin Huffman had been move to alternate after the last shakeup. He played second for runner up Brady Clark at last weeks spiel in Duluth.
http://www.teamusa.org/USA-Curling/...-Program-update
Jason Smith has taken Brunt's place apparently.
http://www.teamusa.org/USA-Curling/...-Program-update
__________________
Recreational curler & resident armchair curler at Windy City Curling Club.
Co-host of the NerdCurl podcast & occasional blogger.
http://www.nerdcurl.com
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12-04-15 12:54PM |
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fanofcurling
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Mar 2009
Location:
Posts: 81 |
quote: Originally posted by Phil_D
Jason Smith has taken Brunt's place apparently.
http://www.teamusa.org/USA-Curling/...-Program-update
Yet another example of the inconsistency of the HPP. They tell athletes you NEED to be out there playing competitively on a regular basis to even be considered for the program.
I think Jason is one of the greatest guys in US Curling, but he hasn't been involved in competitive curling for 4 or 5 or 6 years... (EXCEPT this week in the mixed doubles)
So all you competitive curlers out there. Don't bother putting in the time. It's not a factor. Someone who hasn't shown his face for years has just passed you by. THAT'S the message they just sent out.
Another example of how the HPP is killing competitive curling in this country.
Question: Why didn't Colin move into the open lead position? He's thrown lead for the last 3 or 4 years (except this year). Is he "really" still in the program?
Question: Why did Sean B. "leave" the program this year only to return midseason?
Question: Why is everything always so mysterious with all the athletes in the HPP past, present and future? Do they have gag orders?
Question: What will happen with the women's HPP next year. E Brown coming on board, and the best Junior team aging out (i think)? They'll fund four teams next year? Is there that much money?
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12-05-15 12:16PM |
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Grat
Hitting Paint
Registered: Mar 2014
Location:
Posts: 107 |
quote: Originally posted by fanofcurling
Question: Why is everything always so mysterious with all the athletes in the HPP past, present and future? Do they have gag orders?
I don't think it's anything that nefarious. This isn't the NFL where media shows up after every game, GMs and coaches have press conferences and radio shows, and reporters are writing articles from anonymous sources. Players will talk, but they are talking to friends and fellow curlers, not to anyone who's going to publish their comments.
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12-05-15 01:05PM |
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IMWright
Swing Artist
Registered: Dec 2014
Location:
Posts: 206 |
quote: Originally posted by fanofcurling
Yet another example of the inconsistency of the HPP. They tell athletes you NEED to be out there playing competitively on a regular basis to even be considered for the program.
I think Jason is one of the greatest guys in US Curling, but he hasn't been involved in competitive curling for 4 or 5 or 6 years... (EXCEPT this week in the mixed doubles)
So all you competitive curlers out there. Don't bother putting in the time. It's not a factor. Someone who hasn't shown his face for years has just passed you by. THAT'S the message they just sent out.
Another example of how the HPP is killing competitive curling in this country.
Question: Why didn't Colin move into the open lead position? He's thrown lead for the last 3 or 4 years (except this year). Is he "really" still in the program?
Question: Why did Sean B. "leave" the program this year only to return midseason?
Question: Why is everything always so mysterious with all the athletes in the HPP past, present and future? Do they have gag orders?
Question: What will happen with the women's HPP next year. E Brown coming on board, and the best Junior team aging out (i think)? They'll fund four teams next year? Is there that much money?
Was Jason Smith at the combine? If so, was he just the next player on the list from their fair, balanced, and objective evaluations? If not, then the whole combine is just a complete sham and a false front for just picking whoever they want to, and is just done to show the impression of giving everyone a chance, when in reality, that is furthest from the truth...
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12-05-15 04:14PM |
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Phil_D
Drawmaster
Registered: May 2014
Location: Joliet, IL
Posts: 629 |
quote: Originally posted by IMWright
Was Jason Smith at the combine? If so, was he just the next player on the list from their fair, balanced, and objective evaluations? If not, then the whole combine is just a complete sham and a false front for just picking whoever they want to, and is just done to show the impression of giving everyone a chance, when in reality, that is furthest from the truth...
I believe the press release said he was at the combine.
__________________
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Co-host of the NerdCurl podcast & occasional blogger.
http://www.nerdcurl.com
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12-06-15 12:26AM |
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SPMFromPCC
Swing Artist
Registered: Jun 2007
Location:
Posts: 440 |
Yes, Smitty was at the combine. I curl league with him twice a week in Blaine; he knew about this a couple weeks back. HP reached out to him since they needed a replacement for Ryan...it's a decent bet that Smitty was the first alternate for the HP team at the start of the season, though I don't know that for sure.
I'll say this much: he may not be very involved with the competitive scene for the moment (though he and Jess are killing it at doubles), but the dude is still a monster player. I have no problem at all with HP bringing him into the fold. He really should be out there competing anyways, way too much talent to sit on the sidelines.
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12-06-15 08:23AM |
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fanofcurling
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Mar 2009
Location:
Posts: 81 |
quote: Originally posted by SPMFromPCC
Yes, Smitty was at the combine. I curl league with him twice a week in Blaine; he knew about this a couple weeks back. HP reached out to him since they needed a replacement for Ryan...it's a decent bet that Smitty was the first alternate for the HP team at the start of the season, though I don't know that for sure.
I'll say this much: he may not be very involved with the competitive scene for the moment (though he and Jess are killing it at doubles), but the dude is still a monster player. I have no problem at all with HP bringing him into the fold. He really should be out there competing anyways, way too much talent to sit on the sidelines.
I think that by FAR he is the BEST choice to add to the HPP. That wasn't what was being asked or questioned. He's not the issue.
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12-07-15 12:03AM |
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Grat
Hitting Paint
Registered: Mar 2014
Location:
Posts: 107 |
Smitty may not be on the competitive scene, but has probably shown the rest of what they are looking for in making the life commitment. He moved to MN to curl even before being accepted into the program. Based on how he's playing doubles, he's probably putting in the work. And by doing it in Blaine the right people are seeing how much work he's putting in.
I think the message being sent is to keep playing competitively and practicing harder in order to earn your spot, because Jason was playing better after sitting out for five years.
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12-15-15 06:47PM |
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Alice
Swing Artist
Registered: Feb 2012
Location:
Posts: 324 |
When are the HP selections to be announced for the HP challengers v. the recent winners plus 2 others who played those long days of the US Mixed Doubles National to decide who goes to the Worlds?
Would someone please explain when the 29 teams who entered that Mixed Doubles Nationals found out the on-ice winners would not have an automatic berth to Worlds but instead had to face a trials against whomever the HP program picked and whom they had beaten at a "nationals".
And, when was the last time the US Women's National was a sign up and go with not a single state or regional playdowns now we know just 8 women's teams have registered for 2016. Has that ever happened before in the US?
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12-15-15 07:19PM |
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SPMFromPCC
Swing Artist
Registered: Jun 2007
Location:
Posts: 440 |
I've already seen the list of HP teams assembled for the Trials spots. They're doing it like this: eight teams will play off for the four spots at an upcoming HP camp. No idea exactly what format they're using.
The new process for doubles was announced quite some time ago, at least a couple months back. Everyone knew going in that the national champion was not going to worlds, and everyone was essentially playing for one of the three berths to the Trials. That change was one factor (among others) that led to my own team stepping back this time.
As recently as 2010, women's nationals was sign-up-and-go. Heck, even in 2014 there were all of nine teams that played in the Challenge Round to advance six teams.
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12-16-15 12:52PM |
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Frykenstein
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Mar 2009
Location:
Posts: 61 |
quote: Originally posted by Alice
And, when was the last time the US Women's National was a sign up and go with not a single state or regional playdowns now we know just 8 women's teams have registered for 2016. Has that ever happened before in the US?
Yes, several times in the last decade. I don't think playdowns were required in 2006 or 2008-2010.
mf
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12-17-15 01:41AM |
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dbsdbs
Drawmaster
Registered: Feb 2013
Location:
Posts: 812 |
quote: Originally posted by SPMFromPCC
As recently as 2010, women's nationals was sign-up-and-go. Heck, even in 2014 there were all of nine teams that played in the Challenge Round to advance six teams.
Sign up and go makes more sense than a 9-team playoff to eliminate only 3 teams. As I recall, a team might travel to that playdown and win 2 games and be done. Why bother?
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12-17-15 07:57AM |
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AlanMacNeill
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Sep 2011
Location:
Posts: 1064 |
So, basically, it took less than a year since Olympicization...but the HPP has sunk it's claws into Mixed Doubles as well, and now our National Championship really isn't, it's just another Qualifier to a selection Event.
Is the Selection Event at least a "Structured Competition and the team that wins it will go", or is it a "We're gonna look at the eight teams and decide which one we want"?
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12-17-15 01:23PM |
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runinrock
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Jul 2013
Location: 216
Posts: 41 |
Can someone explain to me the purpose of sending a women's team (and coach) to China to play in a tournament that consists of 8 teams, ranked 25 (Englot for SK), 26 (US TEAM),84,94,202,215 OOM, with 2 teams not even ranked? If it was paid for by the Chinese that is one thing...if not, what a waste of time and money...why not send them to Eveleth to not only support a US Cash Spiel, but also to play against 4 teams ranked in the top 50 (two in the top 30), one of which is a likely opponent at worlds?
One doesn't have to be a math wiz to figure out the cost of sending at least 5 people to china for a week vs the cost of the super 8 in Eveleth...could easily use that money to support an entire season for a team of young players..
obviously a rhetorical question because we know Derek, Rick, and the rest don't have a good answer (Unless like I stated above it was paid for by the Chinese.
Just boggles my mind
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12-17-15 01:25PM |
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AlanMacNeill
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Sep 2011
Location:
Posts: 1064 |
Payback for the Chinese team coming to CNIA maybe?
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12-17-15 06:58PM |
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dbsdbs
Drawmaster
Registered: Feb 2013
Location:
Posts: 812 |
It appears that HPP has accomplished at least one thing -- it has greatly reduced the interest of American curlers in the national championships. It used to be that club curlers had a least a passing interest in national events, now except for those competing almost nobody cares. Case in point - HPP posts on CZ used to draw lots of views and comments, but no more. Maybe HPP gets a pass on this because the Olympics has greatly increased interest in curling from the general public, but it seems to me that USA curlers have really lost interest in nationals. Maybe that is not a big deal, but I think it is too bad.
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12-17-15 11:26PM |
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curlky
Drawmaster
Registered: Oct 2013
Location:
Posts: 559 |
quote: Originally posted by dbsdbs
It appears that HPP has accomplished at least one thing -- it has greatly reduced the interest of American curlers in the national championships. It used to be that club curlers had a least a passing interest in national events, now except for those competing almost nobody cares. Case in point - HPP posts on CZ used to draw lots of views and comments, but no more. Maybe HPP gets a pass on this because the Olympics has greatly increased interest in curling from the general public, but it seems to me that USA curlers have really lost interest in nationals. Maybe that is not a big deal, but I think it is too bad.
I cant speak for anyone else, but i don't normally pay much attention to thread about HPP, not because I'm not interested, but because I got tired of reading AlanMacNeill complain about how he hates the system. Sadly, there is no real other place to read about what is going on with the US HPP outside of CZ, so it is a big detriment to me. I only got involved with this thread because I wanted to see what the change was.
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12-17-15 11:54PM |
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Gerry
CZ Founder
Registered: Sep 2002
Location: London, Ontario
Posts: 4002 |
quote: Originally posted by runinrock
Can someone explain to me the purpose of sending a women's team (and coach) to China to play in a tournament that consists of 8 teams, ranked 25 (Englot for SK), 26 (US TEAM),84,94,202,215 OOM, with 2 teams not even ranked? If it was paid for by the Chinese that is one thing...if not, what a waste of time and money...why not send them to Eveleth to not only support a US Cash Spiel, but also to play against 4 teams ranked in the top 50 (two in the top 30), one of which is a likely opponent at worlds?
One doesn't have to be a math wiz to figure out the cost of sending at least 5 people to china for a week vs the cost of the super 8 in Eveleth...could easily use that money to support an entire season for a team of young players..
obviously a rhetorical question because we know Derek, Rick, and the rest don't have a good answer (Unless like I stated above it was paid for by the Chinese.
Just boggles my mind
Costs are covered by the Chinese / Local Hosting Committee.
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12-18-15 07:41AM |
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AlanMacNeill
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Sep 2011
Location:
Posts: 1064 |
quote: Originally posted by curlky
I cant speak for anyone else, but i don't normally pay much attention to thread about HPP, not because I'm not interested, but because I got tired of reading AlanMacNeill complain about how he hates the system. Sadly, there is no real other place to read about what is going on with the US HPP outside of CZ, so it is a big detriment to me. I only got involved with this thread because I wanted to see what the change was.
Feel free to Block me...if you don't know how I suggest learning, but it's exactly two button clicks from this very post.
I pay my money to USCA, I watch curling on TV on those rare opportunities I get, I support a local club that is getting damned near nothing for our annual dues payments other than an ever increasing demand for support of ever shrinking pool of players that USCA cares about. I'm going to speak up, loudly, on the only forum that exists.
Astroturfing "Everything is sunshine and lollipops, the system will work if we only just wish it to harder" ain't gonna fix the game.
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12-18-15 09:17AM |
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curlky
Drawmaster
Registered: Oct 2013
Location:
Posts: 559 |
AlanMacNeill, I never said that you did not have the right to voice your opinion. YOu certainly do regardless of whether you pay dues or not. I am only saying that your negativity had been off putting to me, and as result, I pay less attention to HPP threads.
In my opinion, which I am entitled to just like you are to yours, your anger, hate, vitriol and criticism, with rarely a positive suggestion, should disqualify you with anything associated with a national event, where I know you are a volunteer for. If this were a company, and I were in charge, I would not want this level of unproductive negativism from anyoen involved. There are ways to express displeasure, offer other methods, etc, that allow the conversation to be productive, and I hope that your comments and attitude stick to this level of behavior
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12-18-15 10:59AM |
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AlanMacNeill
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Sep 2011
Location:
Posts: 1064 |
Except of course that I'm negative regarding the *PROCESS* not the *PLAYERS*, who are what do and should matter.
I can, and do, think the various selection processes are biased, poorly designed, and deeply flawed.
But, once sliders hit ice, my responsibility as an official is to ensure that *this* game is fair, regardless of who's in it and what the stakes are or are not.
Hell, ask me after 99% of the games I've officiated in who played and I'd be hard pressed to tell you. But I can tell you with 100% precision exactly what happened the most recent time I had to "intervene" (it's funny they call it that when intervening is the last thing we're supposed to do, we're really primarily supposed to provide a neutral view of what happened and what the relevant rules are so both skips can determine what to do on their own, we only "rule" when there is an irrecoverable dispute on proper action)
It's called professionalism. My ranting and raving between events has zero impact on my ability to fairly call the action on the ice.
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12-18-15 11:17AM |
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runinrock
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Jul 2013
Location: 216
Posts: 41 |
quote: Originally posted by Gerry
Costs are covered by the Chinese / Local Hosting Committee.
...and there you have it! Thanks Gerry
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