Disclaimer: CurlingZone does not represent or endorse the accuracy or reliability of any Content posted on any Forums area and you acknowledge that any reliance upon such Content shall be at your sole risk. Any Content placed on any Forums area by users and anonymous posters are the views of the user posting the statement, and do not represent the views of CurlingZone or our partners, advertisers or sponsors. By posting anonymously, you are allowing your IP address to be displayed for identification purposes. CurlingZone reserves the right to remove any post at its discretion without warning or explanation.
04-05-15 05:31PM |
|
watcher2
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Mar 2015
Location:
Posts: 63 |
Will Sport Canada and CCA now smarten up
ill Sport Canada & CCA ever smarten UP?
When will CCA and Sport Canada smarten up and pay our elite curlers a full salary and financial support programs so they can be professional curlers just like Finland, Sweden, Scotland, etc.
CCA can start by cutting in half it's overpaid staff then reducing the remaining salaries to reflect skill levels and marketability .
If CCA doesn't do it then Sport Canada should step in and cut the funding to CCA and redistribute it to support curling.
It is bad enough that we bring these teams to Canada to teach them to beat us, but it is shameful that we handicap our own curlers.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-05-15 05:35PM |
|
lolar3288
Drawmaster
Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Burlington
Posts: 638 |
I doubt it....we would sooner lose than fully fund teams at the expense of the almighty CCA
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-05-15 05:42PM |
|
rick8end
Swing Artist
Registered: Nov 2014
Location: British Columbia
Posts: 202 |
Re: Will Sport Canada and CCA now smarten up
quote: Originally posted by watcher2
ill Sport Canada & CCA ever smarten UP?
When will CCA and Sport Canada smarten up and pay our elite curlers a full salary and financial support programs so they can be professional curlers just like Finland, Sweden, Scotland, etc.
CCA can start by cutting in half it's overpaid staff then reducing the remaining salaries to reflect skill levels and marketability .
If CCA doesn't do it then Sport Canada should step in and cut the funding to CCA and redistribute it to support curling.
It is bad enough that we bring these teams to Canada to teach them to beat us, but it is shameful that we handicap our own curlers.
They only fund their curlers because there are so few elite curlers in their countries. Canada has a wealth of good curling teams, so who exactly do you choose to fully fund? Yes, several nations have caught up to Canada because of the international funding. But Canada can go toe to toe with them in any game and we all know it. There's no need to have one or two teams in Canada fully-funded. That would just hurt the quality of the Slam and the Brier as the fully-funded teams would have a marked advantage.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-05-15 05:45PM |
|
decade
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Jan 2011
Location:
Posts: 1962 |
Re: Will Sport Canada and CCA now smarten up
quote: Originally posted by watcher2
ill Sport Canada & CCA ever smarten UP?
When will CCA and Sport Canada smarten up and pay our elite curlers a full salary and financial support programs so they can be professional curlers just like Finland, Sweden, Scotland, etc.
CCA can start by cutting in half it's overpaid staff then reducing the remaining salaries to reflect skill levels and marketability .
If CCA doesn't do it then Sport Canada should step in and cut the funding to CCA and redistribute it to support curling.
It is bad enough that we bring these teams to Canada to teach them to beat us, but it is shameful that we handicap our own curlers.
"WE" do not bring them to Canada.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-05-15 06:14PM |
|
Gerry
CZ Founder
Registered: Sep 2002
Location: London, Ontario
Posts: 4002 |
Two Men's teams and Two Women's teams are carded at $72,000 per year each season ($1,500 per athlete per month). Teams also receive a nice payout for winning the Brier ($55,000) and Scotties (not sure of number) and payouts for other placements as well. Team also receive cresting money as well to go along with those prizes.
Add in sponsorships and cash payouts, the Canadian teams are getting closer to becoming full-time athletes as well. The expansion of the Grand Slams to 8 events in 2016/17 season and $2.5 million purse make it possible to focus more time on the sport.
__________________
CurlingZone
Everything...Curling!
Please click on our sponsors' banners periodically, as visiting their sites helps keep CurlingZone.com Free!
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-05-15 06:38PM |
|
ott-am
Swing Artist
Registered: Jan 2005
Location:
Posts: 371 |
I am not sure of the exact number, but I believe the Brier money is much higher than the money for the Scotties.
__________________
Art M
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-06-15 11:17AM |
|
lolar3288
Drawmaster
Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Burlington
Posts: 638 |
Re: Re: Will Sport Canada and CCA now smarten up
quote: Originally posted by rick8end
They only fund their curlers because there are so few elite curlers in their countries. Canada has a wealth of good curling teams, so who exactly do you choose to fully fund? Yes, several nations have caught up to Canada because of the international funding. But Canada can go toe to toe with them in any game and we all know it. There's no need to have one or two teams in Canada fully-funded. That would just hurt the quality of the Slam and the Brier as the fully-funded teams would have a marked advantage.
They fund their best teams (starting at junior) because they want to have the best and win.
We don't because we would rather make excuses, put our curlers through financial hell and fund CCA salaries,than smarten up and win. The proof is in the results and Canada has been on the down swing for years.
We may not actually "bring" the teams over but we allow paid professional teams to come here and we develop them. Try taking a job in Sweden or Switzerland in any profession. They have no trouble showing you the airport home!
Watcher2 is right on......We have good teams breaking up because they can't work full time to earn a living, have a family and curl.
Last edited by lolar3288 on 04-06-15 at 11:24AM
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-06-15 11:22AM |
|
lolar3288
Drawmaster
Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Burlington
Posts: 638 |
quote: Originally posted by Gerry
Two Men's teams and Two Women's teams are carded at $72,000 per year each season ($1,500 per athlete per month). Teams also receive a nice payout for winning the Brier ($55,000) and Scotties (not sure of number) and payouts for other placements as well. Team also receive cresting money as well to go along with those prizes.
Add in sponsorships and cash payouts, the Canadian teams are getting closer to becoming full-time athletes as well. The expansion of the Grand Slams to 8 events in 2016/17 season and $2.5 million purse make it possible to focus more time on the sport.
So a team of 5 people, 72K + 55K = 127K/5 = $25,400 LESS EXPENSES.
What does the head of CCA make including expenses?
I'm retired and you couldn't hire me for 5 times that amount.
How much do the European teams make, all expenses covered?
What the Canadians get is peanuts!
Last edited by lolar3288 on 04-06-15 at 11:27AM
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-06-15 06:48PM |
|
ott-am
Swing Artist
Registered: Jan 2005
Location:
Posts: 371 |
quote: Originally posted by lolar3288
So a team of 5 people, 72K + 55K = 127K/5 = $25,400 LESS EXPENSES.
What does the head of CCA make including expenses?
I'm retired and you couldn't hire me for 5 times that amount.
How much do the European teams make, all expenses covered?
What the Canadians get is peanuts!
Good questions lolar. I don't want to go off on a tangent, but if you would not take $127,000 to curl, you are doing alright.
__________________
Art M
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-07-15 12:33AM |
|
Jimbobogie
Drawmaster
Registered: Feb 2014
Location:
Posts: 538 |
What happens when these curlers are deemed to be no longer able to compete at that level and have their money cut off? With no appreciable skills other than curling, I'm sure that there will have to be an enhanced Unemployment Insurance Benefit, won't there? Unless of course you're talking about paying our curlers the same kind of money that NHL players make-they have a pension plan as well.
And with Canada back at the uncontested top of the Curling World, there will no longer be any need to have a stupid World Championship, right?
And with no World Championship there will no longer be any need to waste our time with stupid things like the Olympics, right?
Be careful what you wish for...
__________________
Jim
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-07-15 11:35AM |
|
Marc Bernard
Hitting Paint
Registered: Feb 2005
Location: Elmira
Posts: 179 |
quote: Originally posted by Jimbobogie
What happens when these curlers are deemed to be no longer able to compete at that level and have their money cut off?
Easy - they go coach teams in the "developing curling" countries. Until those countries get better than us, then we increase the funding!
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-07-15 01:47PM |
|
jcullen
Hitting Paint
Registered: Oct 2006
Location:
Posts: 170 |
Re: Re: Re: Will Sport Canada and CCA now smarten up
quote: Originally posted by lolar3288
They fund their best teams (starting at junior) because they want to have the best and win.
We don't because we would rather make excuses, put our curlers through financial hell and fund CCA salaries,than smarten up and win. The proof is in the results and Canada has been on the down swing for years.
We may not actually "bring" the teams over but we allow paid professional teams to come here and we develop them. Try taking a job in Sweden or Switzerland in any profession. They have no trouble showing you the airport home!
Watcher2 is right on......We have good teams breaking up because they can't work full time to earn a living, have a family and curl.
Sports teams coming over here and competing in tournaments is a hell of a lot different than emigrating and taking a job in another country. Canadian teams in all sports compete in leagues/tournaments across the world, that's how sports works.
Two totally different scenarios.
__________________
Host and General Good-Natured Man on "Cullen and a Curler".
Youtube.com/curlingzone
@cullenthecomic
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-07-15 02:56PM |
|
Gerry
CZ Founder
Registered: Sep 2002
Location: London, Ontario
Posts: 4002 |
quote: Originally posted by lolar3288
So a team of 5 people, 72K + 55K = 127K/5 = $25,400 LESS EXPENSES.
What does the head of CCA make including expenses?
I'm retired and you couldn't hire me for 5 times that amount.
How much do the European teams make, all expenses covered?
What the Canadians get is peanuts!
The prize is divided by 4 players. The alternate is not typically part of those teams, especially in part of funding. There's also another 20K not listed in that prize money for cresting. Works out to $36,750 for each of the 4 players.
That doesn't include prize money and sponsorship that these teams earn from playing on the Tour for the season as well.
__________________
CurlingZone
Everything...Curling!
Please click on our sponsors' banners periodically, as visiting their sites helps keep CurlingZone.com Free!
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-07-15 05:48PM |
|
watcher2
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Mar 2015
Location:
Posts: 63 |
quote: Originally posted by Gerry
The prize is divided by 4 players. The alternate is not typically part of those teams, especially in part of funding. There's also another 20K not listed in that prize money for cresting. Works out to $36,750 for each of the 4 players.
That doesn't include prize money and sponsorship that these teams earn from playing on the Tour for the season as well.
And expenses are??? For a week of hotel, food, etc. What about the coach costs?
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-07-15 05:56PM |
|
lolar3288
Drawmaster
Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Burlington
Posts: 638 |
quote: Originally posted by ott-am
Good questions lolar. I don't want to go off on a tangent, but if you would not take $127,000 to curl, you are doing alright.
Let's just say I'm not in the soup line yet, give the Liberals another few years...sorry off topic!
Here is the CCA audited financial report.
http://www.curling.ca/wp-content/up...-Statements.pdf
Page 5 and 15. Funny how the expense sheet is the last page. Also no detail, likely for good reason.
I just received a bleeding heart email from CCA looking for money for junior curlers. I suggest they use some of the millions we tax payers have already given via Sport Canada.
Note: If you want to use the Development fund to donate to your club and get a tax receipt CCA will keep a bounty of 25% of every donation made to the CDF. The CCA will apply 20% of each Club Development Fund donation to support grassroots curling (CCA acceptable) programs across Canada through the Curling Assistance Program (CAP) and keep 5% for themselves (donut fund?) I realize some of this has to do with tax law but I also know there are ways around everything..if you try.
So now to avoid financing CCA we have to find another way to get money to the clubs I support for real curling programs!
Last edited by lolar3288 on 04-07-15 at 06:16PM
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-08-15 08:49AM |
|
watcher2
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Mar 2015
Location:
Posts: 63 |
CCA knows how to hold it's hand out, just not how to reach into it's pockets!
It's seems to think the money is for building CCA kingdom and staff wages not to promote Curling.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-08-15 08:59AM |
|
Gerry
CZ Founder
Registered: Sep 2002
Location: London, Ontario
Posts: 4002 |
quote: Originally posted by watcher2
And expenses are??? For a week of hotel, food, etc. What about the coach costs?
Covered by Curling Canada
__________________
CurlingZone
Everything...Curling!
Please click on our sponsors' banners periodically, as visiting their sites helps keep CurlingZone.com Free!
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-08-15 10:25AM |
|
yukonboy
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Mar 2011
Location:
Posts: 11 |
quote: Originally posted by Gerry
The prize is divided by 4 players. The alternate is not typically part of those teams, especially in part of funding. There's also another 20K not listed in that prize money for cresting. Works out to $36,750 for each of the 4 players.
That doesn't include prize money and sponsorship that these teams earn from playing on the Tour for the season as well.
Gerry, please check your facts. Team NS and Team Yukon got $0 of any of the $. Your numbers may be accurate for the playoff teams, but I am certain that it all depended upon placing how much each team received.
The Yukon team, even though they were a TSN game gets $0 in the $ for cresting from the sponsor. The teams who where 6-12 certainly didn't get $36,750.
Our out of pocket expenses came out of our pocket to compete.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-08-15 10:40AM |
|
Gerry
CZ Founder
Registered: Sep 2002
Location: London, Ontario
Posts: 4002 |
quote: Originally posted by yukonboy
Gerry, please check your facts. Team NS and Team Yukon got $0 of any of the $. Your numbers may be accurate for the playoff teams, but I am certain that it all depended upon placing how much each team received.
The Yukon team, even though they were a TSN game gets $0 in the $ for cresting from the sponsor. The teams who where 6-12 certainly didn't get $36,750.
Our out of pocket expenses came out of our pocket to compete.
Costs were covered for the Pre-Qualifier teams, but as with most events, finishing last (or outside the competition) does not win prize money.
For teams who finished 7-12, I believe they received $5,000 plus another $1,000 for cresting.
__________________
CurlingZone
Everything...Curling!
Please click on our sponsors' banners periodically, as visiting their sites helps keep CurlingZone.com Free!
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-08-15 06:38PM |
|
watcher2
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Mar 2015
Location:
Posts: 63 |
quote: Originally posted by Gerry
Costs were covered for the Pre-Qualifier teams, but as with most events, finishing last (or outside the competition) does not win prize money.
For teams who finished 7-12, I believe they received $5,000 plus another $1,000 for cresting.
$5k Just what do you think a 10 days in a hotel costs for 5 people? 3 rooms at $150 is $1500 plus good old Canadian tax.
Food, another $300 a day for $3000. Then there are flights at maybe $800 each. Then there is the lost weeks wages.
The above accounts for a coach and 4 team members. Some teams have a 5th player
I bet CCA covered all CCA Employees expenses plus they got paid for the week as well, and no $60 a day limit on food! I bet they didn't share rooms either.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-08-15 07:14PM |
|
decade
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Jan 2011
Location:
Posts: 1962 |
quote: Originally posted by watcher2
$5k Just what do you think a 10 days in a hotel costs for 5 people? 3 rooms at $150 is $1500 plus good old Canadian tax.
Food, another $300 a day for $3000. Then there are flights at maybe $800 each. Then there is the lost weeks wages.
The above accounts for a coach and 4 team members. Some teams have a 5th player
I bet CCA covered all CCA Employees expenses plus they got paid for the week as well, and no $60 a day limit on food! I bet they didn't share rooms either.
cca pays for hotels, flights and meals for players and coach.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-08-15 07:19PM |
|
Borough Boy
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Oct 2007
Location:
Posts: 48 |
quote: Originally posted by decade
cca pays for hotels, flights and meals for players and coach.
Exactly, gotta love guys posting and railing on things they have no clue about.
Didn't figure that the 5 k is prize money ON TOP of expenses lol
So now go back and factor in air, hotels etc and do still feel the same?
Don't forget, before those 20 teams boycotted back in the early 2000's there was no prize money, no cresting money etc.
This has come a long way.
Last edited by Borough Boy on 04-08-15 at 07:22PM
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-09-15 04:56AM |
|
aku
Knee-Slider
Registered: Sep 2002
Location: Finland
Posts: 1 |
Re: Will Sport Canada and CCA now smarten up
quote: Originally posted by watcher2
ill Sport Canada & CCA ever smarten UP?
When will CCA and Sport Canada smarten up and pay our elite curlers a full salary and financial support programs so they can be professional curlers just like Finland, Sweden, Scotland, etc.
You can leave us (team Finland) out of that pro list. Our "funding" wasn't even enough to cover our flights to Halifax.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-09-15 09:54AM |
|
Borough Boy
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Oct 2007
Location:
Posts: 48 |
quote: Originally posted by lolar3288
Let's just say I'm not in the soup line yet, give the Liberals another few years...sorry off topic!
Here is the CCA audited financial report.
http://www.curling.ca/wp-content/up...-Statements.pdf
Page 5 and 15. Funny how the expense sheet is the last page. Also no detail, likely for good reason.
I just received a bleeding heart email from CCA looking for money for junior curlers. I suggest they use some of the millions we tax payers have already given via Sport Canada.
Note: If you want to use the Development fund to donate to your club and get a tax receipt CCA will keep a bounty of 25% of every donation made to the CDF. The CCA will apply 20% of each Club Development Fund donation to support grassroots curling (CCA acceptable) programs across Canada through the Curling Assistance Program (CAP) and keep 5% for themselves (donut fund?) I realize some of this has to do with tax law but I also know there are ways around everything..if you try.
So now to avoid financing CCA we have to find another way to get money to the clubs I support for real curling programs!
Not sure if you gave the financial statements a good look, but they are done by an independent firm. That is standard for all big operations. I know those accountants are crazy people, trying to deceive by putting financial details on differing pages and all, my God. Are you serious?
I'm not sure exactly what you are implying by the expenses being listed on page 15? Page 5 is a revenue and expense statemetn, so what? Would it better suit if it was on page 3? page 1, what the hell is the difference? Are you suggesting the independent firm is trying to hide something? And no detail, this isn't the Lions Club in Grimsby, maybe they care about how many pens are used, this is a big operation.
If they didn't have this type of documentation done by an independent firm, then I would be worried.
I would suggest you go and pull out financial statements from any coroporation and you will find this pefrectly in order. Trying to suggest otherwise is misleading and pure BS.
Not sure what agenda you have or what your beef is, but come up with a little more than copying a public document, done by an independent firm before suggesting something untoward.
Last edited by Borough Boy on 04-09-15 at 10:23AM
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-09-15 03:15PM |
|
murphyj87
Swing Artist
Registered: Jan 2007
Location: Dartmouth, NS
Posts: 207 |
quote: Originally posted by lolar3288
I just received a bleeding heart email from CCA looking for money for junior curlers. I suggest they use some of the millions we tax payers have already given via Sport Canada.
So long as a club executive can take for itself all the finances of one of the strongest junior programs in the province by the stroke of a pen, then finances of junior curling will be in trouble, no matter how much money is provided to junior curling.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
|
All times are GMT. The time now is . |
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
|
HTML code is OFF
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
|
|
|
|
|
|