Disclaimer: CurlingZone does not represent or endorse the accuracy or reliability of any Content posted on any Forums area and you acknowledge that any reliance upon such Content shall be at your sole risk. Any Content placed on any Forums area by users and anonymous posters are the views of the user posting the statement, and do not represent the views of CurlingZone or our partners, advertisers or sponsors. By posting anonymously, you are allowing your IP address to be displayed for identification purposes. CurlingZone reserves the right to remove any post at its discretion without warning or explanation.
04-02-13 05:26AM |
|
GregJP
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 378 |
Re: US team
quote: Originally posted by Flatfoot
Is this really the best men's team in the USA ? All 4 guys discuss every shot and not very intelligently. Really disappointed in the strategy at the world championships so far.
I think a more interesting question is where each of the teams would rank in the world top 300 or even 500. First I'd guess that 450 (at least) of the top 500 teams in the world would be Canadian.
Canada, Scotland, Sweden, and Norway would all be within the world top 20.
The Chinese team probably in the top 100. Maybe in the top 50. Maybe something similar for the Swiss.
After that it gets hard to estimate. I think there are easily 300 teams in Canada better than both Russia and Finland. Maybe 500. Maybe more.
I'm not sure what to say about the American team. The front end is terrible and some of the discussions they were having against Canada left me scratching my head. I think they'd have trouble even making provincials in provinces like Alberta.
I've been watching curling since the early 70s and it saddens me that so little progress has been made internationally. How many teams are there outside Canada that would have any chance of winning a Brier? 5? 10?
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 07:15AM |
|
curlerbroad
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Feb 2004
Location: Toronto
Posts: 2668 |
Re: team canada wins 5
quote: Originally posted by rocking chair curler
I think Team Jacobs is doing a fabulous job of keeping the competition at bay. Thank goodness they won't waste their time reading the negative stuff on here. There are only 2 teams that are a real threat remaining, and that is Norway and Sweden. Neither team is strong, but squeaking by. I hope that the Canadian fans will suck it up and support this young team. Martin is not here, neither are Howard, Stoughton or Koe. So stop the critical comments and wish these young men all the best. They are playing well. The competition is trying but they are being outplayed at all levels. These are not crappy teams. They all had to compete and make it here just as Team Jacobs did. I for one wish Team Jacobs continued success and would like to see some more positive support. That or maybe this is really just a forum for whiners and critics.
Hear, hear. Time to support this great young team. They are the future and I can see why the old guard of Stoughton, Howard & Martin are not here.
Too bad about the lack of media coverage of this event. It barely gets a mention. I guess competing with hockey, basketball and women's hockey is tough.
__________________
Well Behaved Women Don't Make History.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 07:53AM |
|
nelsosi
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: YYZ, Canada
Posts: 498 |
Didn't sty up for the end of the game, but did the US really shake hands after 6 ends? Seems very early down 'only' 5
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 07:57AM |
|
nelsosi
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: YYZ, Canada
Posts: 498 |
Re: Re: US team
quote: Originally posted by GregJP
I think a more interesting question is where each of the teams would rank in the world top 300 or even 500. First I'd guess that 450 (at least) of the top 500 teams in the world would be Canadian.
Canada, Scotland, Sweden, and Norway would all be within the world top 20.
The Chinese team probably in the top 100. Maybe in the top 50. Maybe something similar for the Swiss.
After that it gets hard to estimate. I think there are easily 300 teams in Canada better than both Russia and Finland. Maybe 500. Maybe more.
I'm not sure what to say about the American team. The front end is terrible and some of the discussions they were having against Canada left me scratching my head. I think they'd have trouble even making provincials in provinces like Alberta.
I've been watching curling since the early 70s and it saddens me that so little progress has been made internationally. How many teams are there outside Canada that would have any chance of winning a Brier? 5? 10?
Another way of thinking about it is what a worlds would look like if you sent each country's 5th or 10th or 20th best team. Would anyone other than Canada have even a remote chance of winning?
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 08:01AM |
|
nelsosi
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: YYZ, Canada
Posts: 498 |
One more thing on the US - as of right now they are in danger of losing their Olympic spot and being forced to the qualification tourney.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 08:33AM |
|
Flatfoot
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Mar 2013
Location:
Posts: 14 |
Re: team canada wins 5
quote: Originally posted by rocking chair curler
They all had to compete and make it here just as Team Jacobs did. I for one wish Team Jacobs continued success and would like to see some more positive support. That or maybe this is really just a forum for whiners and critics.
I would suggest none of them had to compete in the way Jacobs had to in order to get there.
There are absolutely bad teams here. The Czechs, USA, Finland, and Russia would all have trouble making the playoffs in many club men's leagues in Canada. They are awful in both strategy and execution so please don't assimilate their qualifying with the qualifying of Jacobs as it's an insult to Jacobs.
Objective criticism is not whining. For instance, team Canada's lead was sitting 8th in positional play going into last nights draw. Do you think he would say he's playing great? If your lead was sitting at 8th in the brier your team would be struggling, but not at the worlds because other teams either lack strategy or execution to put pressure on Canada. That is not a whine or a lack of support. It is just an opinion. Which I believe is the reason for having a forum in the first place.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 09:05AM |
|
greenroad
Drawmaster
Registered: Feb 2007
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Posts: 706 |
quote: Originally posted by radiowave
Sad really, because despite what Canadian curling fans may think, the World Championships >>> The Brier $ Scotties. Saying you are a World Champion is where it's at, being the Canadian Champion is secondary. It doesn't matter if it may be harder to win, a World Champion is a World Champion. The rest of the world could care less about the Brier and Scotties.
I've given up watching Brad stiff it to a bunch of Euros and am watching matches on World Curling TV. The times are awkward for me (the only one I can watch is the morning draw) but I saw a pretty good contest between Japan and China. China especially played well.
__________________
The tragedy is not in losing; it's in almost winning.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 09:14AM |
|
GregJP
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 378 |
Re: Re: team canada wins 5
quote: Originally posted by Flatfoot
There are absolutely bad teams here. The Czechs, USA, Finland, and Russia would all have trouble making the playoffs in many club men's leagues in Canada. They are awful in both strategy and execution so please don't assimilate their qualifying with the qualifying of Jacobs as it's an insult to Jacobs.
How many actual non-Canadian teams are there that play at a level that is considered elite? I'm not even talking at the Howard, Martin, Stoughton, Jacobs, Gushue, Koe, McEwan level.
I mean at a level where the team could enter a Grand Slam and have even a remote chance of qualifying.
2 or 3 Swiss teams, 2 or 3 Swedish teams, a few Scottish teams, Ulsrud, the Chinese team, maybe 2 or 3 American teams playing really well for a weekend.
But on the other hand, how many elite Canadian teams are there? Probably only 20-30. The sport has become really polarized with a few teams at a "professional" level and the rest just doing it for fun and mostly as a social thing.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 09:43AM |
|
Unregistered
Guest
Registered: Not Yet
Location:
Posts: N/A |
The crowds will improve by the weekend. Victoria is an expensive place to not only stay, but also to get to. Its also not a hotbed of curling so they don't have a large home base of local fans to fill most of the seats. And face it, how many people have the time and money to spend the whole week in the stands?
Combine that with great spring weather attracting oldsters to golf courses like flies to honey and it equals empty seats until Thursday. That's when the round robin gets interesting, playoffs near and the ferries start dropping off lower mainlanders. Virtually the same thing happened a few years back when the women's worlds were held in Vernon.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: 209.121.225.181
|
|
04-02-13 09:49AM |
|
sternwheeler
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: Canoe Cove, PEI
Posts: 411 |
yep it sure is expensive to stay there but....
quote: Originally posted by Unregistered
The crowds will improve by the weekend. Victoria is an expensive place to not only stay, but also to get to. Its also not a hotbed of curling so they don't have a large home base of local fans to fill most of the seats. And face it, how many people have the time and money to spend the whole week in the stands?
Combine that with great spring weather attracting oldsters to golf courses like flies to honey and it equals empty seats until Thursday. That's when the round robin gets interesting, playoffs near and the ferries start dropping off lower mainlanders. Virtually the same thing happened a few years back when the women's worlds were held in Vernon.
if you have family member or a friend to "couch surf" with... Victoria offers mostly a early spring to visitors at this time of year much more so than here on the other side of Canada being PEI...
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 09:50AM |
|
greenroad
Drawmaster
Registered: Feb 2007
Location: Mid-Atlantic
Posts: 706 |
Re: Re: Re: team canada wins 5
quote: Originally posted by GregJP
But on the other hand, how many elite Canadian teams are there? Probably only 20-30. The sport has become really polarized with a few teams at a "professional" level and the rest just doing it for fun and mostly as a social thing.
That's like all sports. A few elite players and a multitudes of "others". The most important thing internationally is that the quality of the opposition has improved considerably over recent years. This is especially true with the women were our best player of recent years, Jennifer Jones, has only been able to win one World's and most of our top women haven't.
__________________
The tragedy is not in losing; it's in almost winning.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 10:18AM |
|
nelsosi
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: YYZ, Canada
Posts: 498 |
Re: Re: Re: Re: team canada wins 5
quote: Originally posted by greenroad
That's like all sports. A few elite players and a multitudes of "others". The most important thing internationally is that the quality of the opposition has improved considerably over recent years. This is especially true with the women were our best player of recent years, Jennifer Jones, has only been able to win one World's and most of our top women haven't.
I think the only real difference on the women's side is that other countries top couple of teams are very comparable to Canada's top womens teams, but the difference in depth is still staggering. If you pitted the 10th best Canadian women's team against the 10th best team from every other country it wouldn't be a contest. The playing field at the very very top is now fairly level in women's curling, but the depth is still an issue.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 10:42AM |
|
freezetothehack
Hitting Paint
Registered: Feb 2005
Location: New Brunswick
Posts: 199 |
Re: Re: US team
quote: Originally posted by GregJP
How many teams are there outside Canada that would have any chance of winning a Brier? 5? 10?
The correct answer is likely none. Wrong choice of word. None, period.
__________________
Freeze to the hack... the toughest shot in curling!
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 11:09AM |
|
Oly M. Pics
Hitting Paint
Registered: Mar 2013
Location:
Posts: 123 |
Re: Re: Re: US team
quote: Originally posted by freezetothehack
The correct answer is likely none. Wrong choice of word. None, period.
NONE is the correct answer. For any teams outside of Canada to have a chance, B.C. Ab. Sask. Man. NFLD, and Ont. would have to not show up.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 11:28AM |
|
nelsosi
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: YYZ, Canada
Posts: 498 |
Re: Re: Re: US team
quote: Originally posted by freezetothehack
The correct answer is likely none. Wrong choice of word. None, period.
Disagree. There are a handful (Brewster/Murdoch, Edin, Ulsrud immediately come to mind). They wouldn't be favourites, but they would certainly be in the mix on a good week. Edin won an event here with a very good field just a few weeks ago.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 11:43AM |
|
Oly M. Pics
Hitting Paint
Registered: Mar 2013
Location:
Posts: 123 |
Re: Re: Re: Re: US team
quote: Originally posted by nelsosi
Disagree. There are a handful (Brewster/Murdoch, Edin, Ulsrud immediately come to mind). They wouldn't be favourites, but they would certainly be in the mix on a good week. Edin won an event here with a very good field just a few weeks ago.
China also won an event. Doesn't mean they would have a chance in the Brier.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 12:07PM |
|
GregJP
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2006
Location: Edmonton
Posts: 378 |
While I'm posting for the first time in a few years.........
I need to get this off of my chest.
If any of you ever meet Vic Rauter can you do me a favour and tell him the following...
1. When a skip is drawing against two or three opposition rocks he is in fact in that scenario "forced" to take one.
2. When a skip nose hits on an attempted blank or rolls out on a hit for two he's NOT "forced" to take one. He takes one by making an error and there's nothing forced about it.
Vic has been saying this for 20+ years and every time he makes this mistake I feel like throwing a liquid refreshment at the TV.
Am I the only person out of the millions who have watched curling on TSN over the years who is constantly annoyed by this?
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 01:06PM |
|
sternwheeler
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: Canoe Cove, PEI
Posts: 411 |
hahahahaha you met Vic Rauter did you ?
quote: Originally posted by GregJP
While I'm posting for the first time in a few years.........
I need to get this off of my chest.
If any of you ever meet Vic Rauter can you do me a favour and tell him the following...
1. When a skip is drawing against two or three opposition rocks he is in fact in that scenario "forced" to take one.
2. When a skip nose hits on an attempted blank or rolls out on a hit for two he's NOT "forced" to take one. He takes one by making an error and there's nothing forced about it.
Vic has been saying this for 20+ years and every time he makes this mistake I feel like throwing a liquid refreshment at the TV.
Am I the only person out of the millions who have watched curling on TSN over the years who is constantly annoyed by this?
well believe me I have at last years Brier and his knowledge of curling is such I know he never played the game, only in his mind he thinks he did just ask Russ Howard and Ray Turnbull (former host) and they'll tell you poor Vic doesn't wear the drawers in the family.... he is a "yes man" and he loves it
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 01:32PM |
|
sternwheeler
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: Canoe Cove, PEI
Posts: 411 |
Did you see that smile from B.J gave...
after those Czechs scored their deuce to tie with Canada?
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 01:47PM |
|
sternwheeler
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: Canoe Cove, PEI
Posts: 411 |
never mind the smile how about that "flash'?
skip Jacobs missed his rock, hope it doesn't come back to haunt him later in game, never what to be 'Czech mated" by them?
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 01:57PM |
|
nelsosi
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: YYZ, Canada
Posts: 498 |
Not watching the game - did Jacobs try one of those takeouts with 1/2 inch margin for error? The kind he hasn't missed since the Brier?
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 02:06PM |
|
sternwheeler
Swing Artist
Registered: Mar 2012
Location: Canoe Cove, PEI
Posts: 411 |
your probably right ....
either way Czech team must not be taken lightly
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 02:09PM |
|
nelski
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Oct 2004
Location: Twin Snowbanks
Posts: 2068 |
LOL. Michel gives up a fiver to Edin and the game is still tied up at six after seven. Could only happen in men's curling.
__________________
Lots of major youth (<21) events. Nice for Murdoch... and us :-D.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
04-02-13 02:15PM |
|
chapnlie
Swing Artist
Registered: Jan 2005
Location:
Posts: 282 |
I am amazed by the masses jumping on the Jacobs bandwagon. A word of caution, folks, this is just the round robin! The Jacobs rink is playing great, but have had little pressure on them. The playoffs is where it counts, and I wouldn't be so quick to write-off Edin and Murdock/Brewster.
Report this post to a moderator | IP: Logged
|
|
|
All times are GMT. The time now is . |
|
|
|
|
|
Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
|
HTML code is OFF
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
|
|
|
|
|
|