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| 02-23-22 04:26PM |
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decade
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Jan 2011
Location:
Posts: 1962 |
quote:
Originally posted by Deliverer
"Which verb fits Homan?" decade
Give your limited choice, it seems to me the verb "succeed" fits very well; "fail" is not a verb.
Spruce up on your grammar rules Deliverer. Did you fail English class?
I am not saying and never would that Homan's overall career was not a success. But she has definitely failed to win an Olympic medal , given gteh chance.
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| 02-23-22 04:58PM |
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Deliverer
Swing Artist
Registered: Nov 2016
Location:
Posts: 471 |
quote:
Originally posted by Maggie
What does age have to do with their accomplishments? Who is the greatest is always subjective to a certain extent.
I’m curious. What part of speech do you think ‘fail’ is?
Many believe, and I agree, there is no timeline for "achievement" although success and achievement at a relatively young age usually points to continued success.
To indentify any part of speech it is necessary to analyze the function that word plays in a sentence. When the word "fail" is used as a noun, it refers to either a failure or a failing grade in something. I believe that's exactly what decade was implying about Homan, but let's not guess and wait for his response.
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| 02-23-22 05:11PM |
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Bulls Eye
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Mar 2017
Location:
Posts: 80 |
quote:
Originally posted by curlingclips
If this idea is bad, please explain how. Address the idea, not the person proposing the idea.
I'll bite. Its a bad idea because the WCF runs the PCCC. Participants at WCF events are reps determined by their members, national curling organizations. These organization select a single rep for each event (in whatever manner suits them). To my knowledge there has never been more that one rep per nation at any WCF event. Sub national curling organizations have no status with the WCF and are not part of the process.
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| 02-23-22 05:32PM |
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curlingclips
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Oct 2019
Location:
Posts: 1523 |
quote:
Originally posted by Bulls Eye
To my knowledge there has never been more that one rep per nation at any WCF event.
This is demonstrably false.
WCF sanctions 2019 Curling World Cup Grand Final. There were 2 representatives for Canada for the men's, Matt Dunstone and Kevin Koe.
For mixed doubles, there were 2 representatives for Canada (Sahaidak/Lott and Walker/Muyres) and Switzerland (Perret/Rios and Jäggi/Michel).
In total, the 2018-2019 season Curling World Cup had 3 previous legs in addition to the Grand Final. Including the legs, Canada sent a total of 4 different women's teams (Rachel Homan, Tracy Fleury, Darcy Robertson, Jennifer Jones), 3 different men's teams (Kevin Koe, Jason Gunnlaugson, Matt Dunstone), and 3 different mixed doubles teams (Walker/Muyres, Park/Morris, Sahaidak/Lott).
----------------------
Even if we ignore the Curling World Cup, countries regularly send different teams to qualify them for the World Championships than the teams that actually represent them at World Championships.
When Brazil challenged Canada in the January 2018 Americas Challenge, Canada sent Glenn Howard. Canada won and sent Brad Gushue to 2018 World Men's.
When Brazil and Guyana challenged United States in November 2018, United States sent Rich Ruohonen. United States won and sent John Shuster to 2019 World Men's.
Japan was represented by Tori Koana at 2018 World Women's. They sent Satsuki Fujisawa to 2018 Pacific-Asia Curling Championship to qualify them for 2019 World Women's, where they sent Seina Nakajima.
quote:
Originally posted by Bulls Eye
Sub national curling organizations have no status with the WCF and are not part of the process.
I don't know what you're trying to say with this. Canada Cup is sanctioned by Curling Canada. Curling Canada is a member association of WCF.
Curling Canada can easily send a different team to Pan-Continental than to World, just like they sent Glenn Howard to 2018 Americas Challenge and Brad Gushue to 2018 World Men's.
Had Glenn Howard lost that challenge to Brazil, Canada would not have played in 2018 World Men in Las Vegas, meaning that Gushue would have won the 2018 Brier essentially for nothing.
Last edited by curlingclips on 02-23-22 at 06:03PM
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| 02-23-22 06:20PM |
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curlingclips
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Oct 2019
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So basically here's my proposal with timeline.
From observation, we can assume that the order of events will be the following
1a. Pan-Continental (qualifier for Worlds, so of course it comes earlier)
1b. Canada Cup (usually November/December)
2. Scotties/Brier
3. World Men's & Women's
I propose that Canada Cup winners go to Worlds that season (1b goes to 3 instead of 2 goes to 3). Scotties/Brier winners go to Pan-Continental next season (2 goes to 1a after months of preparation).
So even if a weak team somehow won the Scotties/Brier, there would be months of preparation to get them to qualify Canada at Pan-Continental, where they "only" need to finish in Top 5 with no European teams and so far only 3 strong Asian teams.
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| 02-23-22 09:23PM |
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MeaghanEdwards
Drawmaster
Registered: Aug 2018
Location:
Posts: 699 |
Back on the subject of team changes, Jillian Babin from Team Crawford has recently relocated to Ontario and will be focusing on other priorities.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CaVjYbEviJa/
quote:
team.crawford
After a great season and many great years together, we are sad to be losing our second, Jillian Babin. 🙁
Jill she has recently relocated to Ontario and will be focusing on other priorities.
We will greatly miss Jill both on and off the ice, but appreciate the amazing relationship we have formed!
The team will now be determining how best to fill this role and are looking ahead at the upcoming season, to build on this past years success!
Thank you again to all of our amazing friends, family, fans and supporters. Best wishes, Jill! ❤️
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| 02-23-22 10:22PM |
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FleuryFan
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Dec 2018
Location:
Posts: 53 |
quote:
Originally posted by MeaghanEdwards
Back on the subject of team changes, Jillian Babin from Team Crawford has recently relocated to Ontario and will be focusing on other priorities.
https://www.instagram.com/p/CaVjYbEviJa/
It will be interesting to see who they add to their lineup. Since Crawford, Quillian and Forward are all from NB they can add anyone from across the country as their import player. Could get a top tier competitor due to their recent success at the Scotties.
A team that I see breaking up after this season is de Cruz. They've had a quite lackluster year besides winning the Swiss Trials and finished in seventh place at the Olympics. They also just lost their first game of the Swiss Championship...
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| 02-24-22 11:55AM |
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hogged again
Drawmaster
Registered: Mar 2019
Location:
Posts: 659 |
quote:
Originally posted by curlingclips
So even if a weak team somehow won the Scotties/Brier, there would be months of preparation to get them to qualify Canada at Pan-Continental, where they "only" need to finish in Top 5 with no European teams and so far only 3 strong Asian teams.
Weak teams don't win the Brier/Scotties anymore. The winner is one of the top half dozen elite teams. The last big upset at the Brier was at least 15 years back with Menard or Dacey. The last Scotties surprise was 10 years back with Nedohin or Holland. In the past 5-10 years the elite teams have separated themselves even more from the pack and the odds of a "weak team" winning are nearly zero. The winner of the Scotties/Brier and the winners of the Canada Cup and any other big bonspiel will come from that select group every time so why change at all? Brier and Scotties winners go to the worlds period.
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| 02-24-22 12:13PM |
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curlingclips
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Oct 2019
Location:
Posts: 1523 |
quote:
Originally posted by hogged again
why change at all?
I recommend reading ROCK AND A HARD PLACE By Kristina Rutherford
https://www.sportsnet.ca/curling/lo...t-back-to-no-1/
quote:
Curling Canada has acknowledged change is necessary to keep up with the rest of the world’s elite. The thing is, theirs is an amateur athletic association trying to maintain the grassroots and small-town club feel of the sport while also producing elite athletes that win international championships.
"By the way we do the Olympic trials, we’ve already admitted that the Scotties and the Brier formats aren’t the best format to decide who goes to a world championship,” says [Chelsea] Carey. She wonders about determining the world representative through the Canada Cup, which is a best-on-best between the country’s top-ranked teams.
[Brent] Laing wants to see the Brier and Scotties return to a more amateur level, that might not even see the top teams playing in it.
There are other ideas too, but none of them really addressed what Canada should do with the Pan-Continental. My proposal is an attempt to combine Chelsea Carey and Brent Laing's ideas with this brand new event.
Last edited by curlingclips on 02-24-22 at 04:33PM
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| 02-24-22 02:40PM |
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FleuryFan
Harvey Hacksmasher
Registered: Dec 2018
Location:
Posts: 53 |
Team St-Georges announced that Hailey Armstrong is leaving the team.
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| 02-24-22 03:00PM |
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oliviertoisel
Drawmaster
Registered: Feb 2021
Location:
Posts: 587 |
It's worth noting that the concept "best international teams are elite athletes" is factually wrong. Yes you have your Nik Edins and Bruce Mouats/Eve Muirheads, but you also have members of the Hasselborg team and people like Alina Patz who have day jobs. They're no different from people like full-time curlers Homan or main-time curlers with jobs like Koe or Gushue.
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| 02-24-22 03:33PM |
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UnattachedFC
Swing Artist
Registered: Jan 2016
Location:
Posts: 240 |
I wonder where St-Georges could go. I think that they'd be able to get an experienced curler from Ontario. I don't want to name names, but if I were to guess, that's where I'd go first.
As for Homan, I think that they can literally go anywhere to replace Courtney. If they are commited to the 4 year cycle. Homan's team can play out of Ontario no matter who they bring in, but I wouldn't be shocked if their newest player is from Alberta that they play out of there.
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| 02-24-22 04:06PM |
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curlingclips
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Oct 2019
Location:
Posts: 1523 |
quote:
Originally posted by oliviertoisel
They're no different from people like full-time curlers Homan or main-time curlers with jobs like Koe or Gushue.
From what I understand, the biggest difference is that Swedish teams in particular are 100% fully reimbursed for their curling-related expenses. There's basic budget to cover hotels, flights, entry fees, equipment, food, etc. Additional expenses are first paid out of pockets, but if they keep their receipts, they'll get the money reimbursed 100% eventually.
https://www.cbc.ca/sports/olympics/...nding-1.4605136
Now, Canada does have national teams (full list: https://www.curling.ca/becoming-tea...l-team-program/ ), but I'm not sure if it has similar 100% reimbursement policy.
If Canada does reimburse 100% and all 9 of those men & women teams basically are curling for free, then I don't know what else to say other than there must be something inherently wrong with the provincialism/residency system.
https://www.sportsnet.ca/curling/lo...t-back-to-no-1/
quote:
What’s crystal clear, by Curling Canada’s own admission, is the system has to change if success on the world stage is a primary goal.
“If your only objective was international medals, you never would have come up with this model,” Peckham says. “I’ve always been prepared to tell people that sometimes I thought we won medals in spite of our model, not because of it.”
Last edited by curlingclips on 02-24-22 at 04:22PM
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| 02-24-22 05:25PM |
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hogged again
Drawmaster
Registered: Mar 2019
Location:
Posts: 659 |
You can bring up all the quotes and comments you want, they do not, repeat, do not change any outcomes. Curl Canada wants changes because they exist to "manage" the game and have to do something to justify their jobs. Carey saying to use the Canada Cup as it's "best on best" ignores the fact that the outcome is the same.
Bottom line, Canada Cup winner and Brier winner and Scotties winner and any big event winner come from the same small group of elite teams who through talent and hard work have distanced themselves from the rest of the pack.
This is all much ado about nothing. In men's play, 9 of the top 13 teams are Canadian. In women's it's half of the top 20. Very little has changed in the past 20 years, there will always be a few teams from outside Canada who will have great success. They get to go to world's and euros and Olympics every single year and have a comfort level that Canada will never have because we have 5-6 teams vying for those spots and they will trade victories no matter the event that decides who reps Canada at the worlds.
Sadly I expect big changes from Curl Canada as I say, they have to justify their existence. Doing small changes and coming up empty would be disastrous so they will make big changes even though those changes will produce the same result.
The Brier and Scotties winners should always rep Canada at the worlds. That's the whole enchilada, they are playing for glory of wearing the Maple Leaf, the cash and perks are just secondary. And even if over half the teams in the event have virtually no chance of winning, they still have that dream and every year one of them makes some noise before fading away which provides some drama. Taking that away and giving it to the Canada Cup winner, the field of which can be determined before the curling season even starts will hurt curling across the country in the long run.
Last edited by hogged again on 02-24-22 at 05:28PM
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| 02-24-22 05:41PM |
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alex
Swing Artist
Registered: Sep 2011
Location: Quesnel
Posts: 420 |
[QUOTE]Originally posted by hogged again
[B]You can bring up all the quotes and comments you want, they do not, repeat, do not change any outcomes. Curl Canada wants changes because they exist to "manage" the game and have to do something to justify their jobs. Carey saying to use the Canada Cup as it's "best on best" ignores the fact that the outcome is the same.
This post is one of the best I have ever read. Very accurate.
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| 02-24-22 05:44PM |
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guido
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Feb 2011
Location: Winnipeg
Posts: 1418 |
I’m not completely positive, but I’m pretty sure that the topic of this thread is team changes.
Not rule changes. Not how stupid curling clips is, not who should play in the brier/Scottie’s, etc. It’s about line up changes ffs!
__________________
It’s me!
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| 02-24-22 05:51PM |
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curlingclips
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Oct 2019
Location:
Posts: 1523 |
quote:
Originally posted by hogged again
The Brier and Scotties winners should always rep Canada at the worlds. That's the whole enchilada, they are playing for glory of wearing the Maple Leaf [...] Taking that away and giving it to the Canada Cup winner [...]
That is the old argument, made for years before WCF created the Pan-Continental.
Now we have the Pan-Continental, and Canada has to qualify to even get to Worlds, year after year.
So if Brier/Scotties winners wear the Maple Leaf to try and qualify Canada to Worlds in Pan-Continental, is that really taking anything away from the glory of winning Brier/Scotties?
That is still a very big honor, and some will say, very big responsibility. The fate of whether or not Canada Cup winner Kerri Einarson goes to World Women's may rest in the hands of, say Scotties winner Andrea Crawford finishing top 5 at Pan-Continental.
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| 02-24-22 06:09PM |
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MeaghanEdwards
Drawmaster
Registered: Aug 2018
Location:
Posts: 699 |
quote:
Originally posted by guido
I’m not completely positive, but I’m pretty sure that the topic of this thread is team changes.
Not rule changes. Not how stupid curling clips is, not who should play in the brier/Scottie’s, etc. It’s about line up changes ffs!
Well said. Good grief. There's no difficulty in creating g a topic about the Brier or an other event. Team change discussion/updates, it's right in the thread title, folks
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| 02-24-22 06:14PM |
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IN-OFF-FOR-2
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Mar 2013
Location:
Posts: 1875 |
quote:
Originally posted by guido
I’m not completely positive, but I’m pretty sure that the topic of this thread is team changes.
Not rule changes. Not how stupid curling clips is, not who should play in the brier/Scottie’s, etc. It’s about line up changes ffs!
Like
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| 02-24-22 06:31PM |
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curlingclips
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Oct 2019
Location:
Posts: 1523 |
quote:
Originally posted by guido
It’s about line up changes ffs!
I'll stop talking about my "Brier/Scotties winners go to Pan-Continental" proposal for now, at least in this thread.
I do (not so) secretly wish that Krista McCarville gets to wear the Maple Leaf to represent Canada at 2022 Pan-Continental, though. I don't think Kerri Einarson should get to wear the Maple Leaf twice and go to both 2022 World Women's and 2022 Pan-Continental for winning 2022 Scotties.
So maybe Scotties/Brier winners go to Worlds, and losers go to Pan-Continental?
Anyway, that's another topic for another time.
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| 02-24-22 06:37PM |
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oliviertoisel
Drawmaster
Registered: Feb 2021
Location:
Posts: 587 |
Improving Canadian curling by sending the loser to international competition is maybe the best idea yet. Genius.
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| 02-24-22 06:38PM |
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MeaghanEdwards
Drawmaster
Registered: Aug 2018
Location:
Posts: 699 |
Back on the subject of team changes, Team Sherry Anderson's non senior team will be breaking up.
From their FB page:
Team Anderson
51ma6on68ftcormm140fd ·
End of an Era folks!
We have had an amazing time together. So many laughs, so many dreams...
Breanne is so excited to start her young family! We cant wait to meet him/her!
Sherry (quoted below) is focusing on her Senior team and the upcoming prov and Worlds! We wish her good luck and continued laughs!
Nancy and Chaelynn are both excited for their continued future in curling whether together or apart is yet to be determined.
We are so proud of our team and all we have accomplished during these strange times.
We wanna thank our coach Shane, who without we never would never have achieved much let alone get to the rink safely!
Our sponsors, and families who dream right along beside us, thank you for being there thru thick and thin. We are nothing without you and no win or loss has meaning without you. We love you all!
Sherry's sign off for now...but onto bigger brighter things!
"Well I have decided that next year I will only play on one curling team with my veteran squad of Patty Hersikorn , Brenda Goertzen and Anita Silvernagle . I want to thank Nancy Martin , Chaelynn Kitz and Breanne Meakin for the last 2 seasons. As crazy as they were in covid times, we shared some wonderful experiences together. Thanks you 3. Good luck Breanne with the baby. (I can't wait to hold him or her). Nancy I wish you all the best in your Mixed doubles career. And if anyone is looking for an awesome sweeper, great thrower, and even better teammate, give Chaelynn a call.
Thanks again to all of our sponsors, supporters and family for being there for us!💜💜💜"
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| 02-24-22 07:30PM |
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IN-OFF-FOR-2
Super Rockchucker
Registered: Mar 2013
Location:
Posts: 1875 |
quote:
Originally posted by oliviertoisel
Improving Canadian curling by sending the loser to international competition is maybe the best idea yet. Genius.
Definitely need a like button.
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| 02-24-22 07:58PM |
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hogged again
Drawmaster
Registered: Mar 2019
Location:
Posts: 659 |
quote:
Originally posted by oliviertoisel
Improving Canadian curling by sending the loser to international competition is maybe the best idea yet. Genius.
LMAO.
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