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<smallfont><b><a href=CurlingZone > Chat Forums > Location Specific & Regional Tour Chat > Manitoba Curling > Viterra Championship - MB Mens - Feb 8-12/17, Portage

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02-11-17 10:19PM
guido is offline Click Here to See the Profile for guido Click here to Send guido a Private Message Find more posts by guido Add guido to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
guido
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quote:
Originally posted by misty1


Obviously it worked out here but it so easily could have gotten him in the ass and it's not exactly a strategy I agree with.


It's the proper strategy. Score 2 or more with hammer. At this level, the other team would be ecstatic if they gave up 1 to get the hammer. Of course last end tied is a different story. Blank 9 in a row if you have to.

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02-11-17 10:20PM
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Manitoba Legend
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Scoreline indicates Reid won the toss but McEwen stole the opening point after a number of blanks.

Reid tied things up and then rocked Mighty Mikey for a go-ahead deuce and controlled the big man from that point on.

3 teams left -

Obvioulsy the 1 & 2 seeds plus #10 (bit of surprise) in Trevor Loreth

Mighty Mike should be able to subdue a #10 seed tomorrow morning - shouldn't he?

I guess it depends on whether McEwen goes into self-destruct mode!

That said prolly 85% chance McEwen vs. Carruthers Manitoba final on Sportsnet tomorrow afternoon!

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02-11-17 10:29PM
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misty1
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quote:
Originally posted by guido

It's the proper strategy. Score 2 or more with hammer. At this level, the other team would be ecstatic if they gave up 1 to get the hammer. Of course last end tied is a different story. Blank 9 in a row if you have to.



I wouldn't exactly call it the proper strategy but whatever. I definitely disagree with that second part.

I don't care about blanking an opening end to get hammer in even ends , that's a smart play. But, come on you came to play so don't burn close to half a game away.

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02-11-17 10:53PM
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On The Nose
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quote:
Originally posted by Phil_D


Right, exactly, I agree 100%.

I got the impression that some posters were assuming the penalty was for breaking the broom, as opposed to falling under the new broom rules this season. My whole point was that it's a case of the new rule(s) having unintended consequences, and nothing to do with breaking a broom out of anger or frustration.

Like I said, for cases like a broken broom the rule needs to be amended...such as your proposal for using the same head from the broken broom on a new broom.


Ok... we're obviously on the same page with this. And so are several others, it seems...

The most simple way to make the rule then, would seem to be that each player must play with the same brush pad (head) for the entire game. This means that they can switch out shafts all they want (though I don't see any reason that they would do this)... and that they can replace any broken shaft, as long as they continue using the same brush pad (although some sort of penalty/consequence should be implemented for those who break more than one broom/shaft in frustration within the same game).

If they break the brush pad out of frustration, then tough luck - they can't replace it. If, however, a brush pad is broken accidentally, it should be allowed to be replaced.

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02-11-17 11:13PM
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Every end you blank when you have an advantage keeps the advantage in the first half and then the second half of the game you gain about 1.5% win rate per end.

It's boring but math says blanking all 9 ends is great strategy. Typically in the men's game teams are 55-57% to win starting with hammer and it only goes up from there by continuing to blank.

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02-12-17 12:09AM
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guido
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quote:
Originally posted by Gerry
Every end you blank when you have an advantage keeps the advantage in the first half and then the second half of the game you gain about 1.5% win rate per end.

It's boring but math says blanking all 9 ends is great strategy. Typically in the men's game teams are 55-57% to win starting with hammer and it only goes up from there by continuing to blank.



Thanks for the stats Gerry. Also, a blank end isn' t necessarily boring. There may be several great shots to get the blank. I recall Edin making a triple, then Koe following with his own triple to end with a blank.
Moskowy also mentioned on twitter that every end was started with a guard.
Misty1, are you actually suggesting that the team with hammer draw or hit for one on purpose???? That is just BAD strategy. Maybe in the 8th end to go up one, maybe not. I think statistically this may be the right decision.

Last edited by guido on 02-12-17 at 12:13AM

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02-12-17 07:07AM
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misty1
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quote:
Originally posted by guido


Thanks for the stats Gerry. Also, a blank end isn' t necessarily boring. There may be several great shots to get the blank. I recall Edin making a triple, then Koe following with his own triple to end with a blank.
Moskowy also mentioned on twitter that every end was started with a guard.
Misty1, are you actually suggesting that the team with hammer draw or hit for one on purpose???? That is just BAD strategy. Maybe in the 8th end to go up one, maybe not. I think statistically this may be the right decision.



I'm okay with blanking to have hammer in even ends, I'm okay with playing defensively to defend a lead.

when you get into a situation where 3 or 4 ends are blanked in a row it gets boring because you want something to happen.it doesnt really matter the shots that it took to get there

Last edited by misty1 on 02-12-17 at 08:01AM

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02-12-17 09:36AM
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quote:
Originally posted by guido


... a blank end isn' t necessarily boring. There may be several great shots to get the blank. I recall Edin making a triple, then Koe following with his own triple to end with a blank.



Very infrequently you may see a blank end like this but that is far from the norm. And it is definitely not going to happen more than once in a game. So what you are left with in a game with lots of blank ends is just plain boredom. The more games that are played like this, the fewer tickets are going to be sold for championship events. I guess the curlers do not care but somebody should.

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02-12-17 10:42AM
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brycejmcewen
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While I agree with y'all about the rule should be amended to allow a player to put his old pad on a non-broken broom, in this case, the pad was the only part of the broom that was broken. It was the new style performance brush that was approved in the last two weeks. The pad has two plastic clips that snap into the broom, and one broke.

And to correct some alternative facts in this thread, Team David Bohn won the MCT Championship this year.

Great run for Loreth. Anyone who's complained that the Olympics have ruined curling, or that it's gotten boring with the same teams always playing on TV should love this. Those boys are old school.

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02-12-17 10:51AM
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nelski
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Well - Mikey opened with a three - so we won't have the blankety blank scenario in the semi.

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02-12-17 11:13AM
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I guess you wouldn't like shut outs in hockey, no hitters in baseball, and such. I can see a blank being boring if it was like pre 4 rock rule. But it isn't. Enjoy the game for what it is, not for what you want it to be.

Last edited by guido on 02-12-17 at 11:27AM

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02-12-17 11:27AM
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CURLER1
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blank

blank ends - if you are watching today's telecast, you would have heard Stoughton say there was a lot of rocks in play every end. But with good curling, lots of doubles, they ended in blanks.

He said rum backs were being made, doubles, draws. McEwens final rock picked in 8, for Reid to take two.

Last edited by CURLER1 on 02-12-17 at 11:30AM

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02-12-17 11:45AM
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misty1
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Re: blank

quote:
Originally posted by CURLER1
blank ends - if you are watching today's telecast, you would have heard Stoughton say there was a lot of rocks in play every end. But with good curling, lots of doubles, they ended in blanks.

He said rum backs were being made, doubles, draws. McEwens final rock picked in 8, for Reid to take two.



Yes, I heard . unfortunate wha happened to Mike.

Last edited by misty1 on 02-12-17 at 11:51AM

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02-12-17 11:50AM
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misty1
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quote:
Originally posted by guido
I guess you wouldn't like shut outs in hockey, no hitters in baseball, and such. I can see a blank being boring if it was like pre 4 rock rule. But it isn't. Enjoy the game for what it is, not for what you want it to be.



Well, I find those sports incredibly boring and hard to pay attention to. Sorry if I could offend any fans.

It's not so much that the blank is happening and the shots are being made to make it it's the end result and just waiting for something to happen

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02-12-17 12:05PM
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CURLER1
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Gunnlaugson

Named by the players for the Pat Spiring award - good on him!

http://viterrachampionship.ca/news/...award-recipient

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02-12-17 01:36PM
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Gerry
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Lots of rocks in play and two teams making a lot of shots can lead to blank ends like yesterday with McEwen and Carruthers. Same thing happened at the Brier last year too.

The players do care, that why they're advocates for the 5-rock rule being used in the Grand Slams.

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02-12-17 01:37PM
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guido
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quote:
Originally posted by misty1



Well, I find those sports incredibly boring and hard to pay attention to. Sorry if I could offend any fans.

It's not so much that the blank is happening and the shots are being made to make it it's the end result and just waiting for something to happen



I am assuming you would be a big fan of losing the hammer if an end is blanked?

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02-12-17 02:01PM
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misty1
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quote:
Originally posted by guido


I am assuming you would be a big fan of losing the hammer if an end is blanked?



well, like i said i can appreciate the strategy of blanking an end to get the hammer in even ends so not really.

its the blanking of 2 , 3 or 4 ends in a row im not a fan of.

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02-12-17 02:28PM
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Ajay
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Rocks in play??? Watching Alberta game ?.. 4 ender.

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02-12-17 02:45PM
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guido
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quote:
Originally posted by Ajay
Rocks in play??? Watching Alberta game ?.. 4 ender.


And 3/6 ends blanked

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02-12-17 04:11PM
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Stoughton

really enjoy listening to Stoughton. Get more insight on the guys.

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02-12-17 06:52PM
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Would love to know what came down on Carruthers for him to relinquish a foursie in eight. A miss obviously. Can anyone deliver a bit more detail. Hang on Mikey. Peak for those trials though.

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02-12-17 07:27PM
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Three
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quote:
Originally posted by nelski
Would love to know what came down on Carruthers for him to relinquish a foursie in eight. A miss obviously. Can anyone deliver a bit more detail. Hang on Mikey. Peak for those trials though.


Mike had a deuce setup and Reid did not want to give two back so had two chances to corner freeze to a stone in the 12 foot behind cover but got deep on both of his stones. Mike had a fairly standard nose hit double for four.

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02-12-17 08:11PM
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nelsosi
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Not directly relevant to this championship, but figured this is a decent place to ask the question....What happened with Rob Fowler? Did he retire from competitive curling?

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02-12-17 08:36PM
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Manitoba Legend
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Just watched replay of the Manitoba final.

Form chart followed for first 7 ends with Reid nursing a narrow lead

But Mikey stunned Reider in 8 by actually out-nuancing Reid & Co.

Didn't help that Reid was probably scored around 25% for that 8th end - 1 out of 4 for his 1st stone; about same for his botched draw that ended up a shooting duck for Mikey for the quadruple toe loop!

Once Mikey popped the four - the faces on Team Carruthers turned from absolute confidence to paralyzed fear. Routine run-out for the #2 favourite McEwen to advance to Brier.

If they curl like they did in Manitoba (mind you most of their games were brutalizing fawns) they'll certainly finish Top 3 in Canada - Koe & Gushue have far more nuance than McEwen and that will be were the battleground is drawn.

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