Registered: Mar 2005
Location: St. Albert
Posts: 839

ATH podcast, available on iTunes, etc.

Jordan, Gerry and Kevin chat during Thursday afternoon of the Tim Horton's Brier. Includes coverage of the first ever Pre-Qualifier, thoughts on new branding for the CCA, controversy between Ontario teams, and results from TSN's two-game-per-draw broadcasts.

http://curling.libsyn.com/ath-03051...s-from-thursday

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Registered: Mar 2009
Location: Burlington
Posts: 638

I happen to be traveling and am in the southern USA.

I have Cogeco cable at home and subscribe to TSN yet I can't get Briar coverage via the internet because TSN has cut it off to everyone. No problem,,,,when I get home I will be cutting TSN off! Without world wide curling coverage it isn't worth anything to me.

If there is a one car funeral backing up the street you know Bell Canada is running it!

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Registered: Mar 2013
Location:
Posts: 1875

http://cricfree.sx/tsn-1-2-3-4-5-live-stream


You may have to keep closing out pop ups at the beginning, do not download anything they offer, it'll say something like you need to download optional player etc..... just keep closing the pop ups until you get the full screen. You'll need to find the tiny little x's in the pop ups to close them. You'll get at least 2 tsn choices

I only have standard cable so when tsn is not broadcasting on my channel I have half a chance to get what's on the others.

Good luck

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Registered: Mar 2013
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quote:

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Originally posted by milobloom
ATH podcast, available on iTunes, etc.

Jordan, Gerry and Kevin chat during Thursday afternoon of the Tim Horton's Brier. Includes coverage of the first ever Pre-Qualifier, thoughts on new branding for the CCA, controversy between Ontario teams, and results from TSN's two-game-per-draw broadcasts.

http://curling.libsyn.com/ath-03051...s-from-thursday

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Registered: Sep 2002
Location: London, Ontario
Posts: 4002

quote:

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Originally posted by IN-OFF-FOR-2



Shortsighted situation...... of course this was wrong. How is it possible that ALL the geniuses at the CCA didn't forsee the possibility of a 3 way tie at 1-1. Again not a pre-qualification..... it's a relegation.

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Registered: Nov 2002
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Posts: 612

I watched the interview with Warren Hansen.

Apparently with all 13 provincial and territorial curling associations and the 10 or so executives at the CCA that agreed and voted on this new format, no one thought this through; that a team would be eliminated from the Brier competition after a round robin without losing any more games than the teams that go through.

This is really something to see....

Last edited by johnnysmoke on 03-05-15 at 11:13PM

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Registered: Mar 2013
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Listening to this broadcast and the cream puff interview with pre-loaded questions with prompting of answers with Hansen, sounds like Gerry is self serving for both himself and the CCA, wants a spot on the board. Is your red jacket size XL? How can you Gerry possibly let him off the hook when he said "I don't remember who voted against relegation". You can't be serious. With all the crap that went on during and after, how can anyone possibly not remember who put up a fight against it? Sounds like Roger Clemens when he "Misremembers" taking the needle. The real story behind the scenes is that many of the provinces and territories voted NO and were subsequently bullied by the CCA into voting FOR relegation, or suffer perceived even worse consequences. Where are the minutes to these meetings? Who will tell the real truth? Please tell us all why Hansen had that big grin and even chuckling while trying to keep a straight face discussing relegation. Take a look again at the video. Smug cannot describe it.



Thank you for the podcast that brings this forward for the rest to hear. I thought journalists, including owners of curling zone were supposed to bring both sides of the story, not their own agenda!!!!!!!

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Registered: Nov 2002
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Ouch! That's a little harsh on Gerry.

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Registered: Mar 2013
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quote:

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Originally posted by Gerry


Relegation is what happens at the end of the Brier. Pre-Qualification is the event they're relegated into.

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Registered: Mar 2013
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quote:

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Originally posted by johnnysmoke
Ouch! That's a little harsh on Gerry.

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Registered: Jan 2005
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Posts: 282

quote:

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Originally posted by lolar3288
I happen to be traveling and am in the southern USA.

I have Cogeco cable at home and subscribe to TSN yet I can't get Briar coverage via the internet because TSN has cut it off to everyone. No problem,,,,when I get home I will be cutting TSN off! Without world wide curling coverage it isn't worth anything to me.

If there is a one car funeral backing up the street you know Bell Canada is running it!

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Registered: Sep 2002
Location: London, Ontario
Posts: 4002

As for the interview, the intent was to give Curling Canada's side of the story. Warren Hansen is not to blame for the changes as this was discussed for many years at the National meetings and voted and approved by the member associations. From there, Curling Canada executed on the new event format.

I believe it was Yukon who voted against the Relegation process. This was discussed at a different time off camera.

As for my position, I'm not against the idea of relegation, which I'm sure is clear enough in the podcast. In general, I am not a fan of the execution of several things within the relegation process, and hope they can be improved upon.

- 1 Up, 1 Down - originally proposed by Curling Canada as 2 Up, 2 Down but member association lowered it to one. Would even support 3 Up, 3 Down to make it more possible to get back.
- No Tiebreakers - obviously a big problem with the issue.
- Better inclusion of teams in the ceremonies and events around the Brier. Once teams were eliminated, they were essentially invisible.

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Registered: Mar 2013
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Thanks Gerry. Not sure if you agree but the whole thing smells of back room politics so that CCA and their members got their way. From what I hear it was very very close on the first vote until the CCA made it clear that they wanted it pushed through and if the 14 member groups did not vote their way, repercussions would be put forth. Have you heard similar or do you wish to comment?

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Registered: Sep 2002
Location: London, Ontario
Posts: 4002

quote:

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Originally posted by IN-OFF-FOR-2
Thanks Gerry. Not sure if you agree but the whole thing smells of back room politics so that CCA and their members got their way. From what I hear it was very very close on the first vote until the CCA made it clear that they wanted it pushed through and if the 14 member groups did not vote their way, repercussions would be put forth. Have you heard similar or do you wish to comment?

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Registered: Mar 2013
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Don't know of any of the politics behind it, but it did take 3-4 years of discussion before it happened.


Therein lies the problem for most of us. If it did take 3-4 years, why is it that 98% of us didn't hear a word about it until it was voted upon and passed? Can't speak for all but most associations had their one rep vote without consulting the provincial clubs or memberships they are supposed to represent. Anything that major is supposed to be brought forth to the provincial membership at the AGM. How do you think it's possible that this was passed, without backroom politics? Maybe it's just me, but I guess I just can't understand how anyone would vote for anything this drastic without consulting the members they're supposed to represent, without ulterior motives.

Thoughts from anyone else?

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Registered: Mar 2005
Location: St. Albert
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I will add that over 20 years ago, fresh out of juniors, I had a conversation with MCA Past-President Dan Hildebrand. Dan explained to me THEN that territories were fighting within political forums for equal representation.

We need to get over the idea the CCA/Curling Canada is Evil.

I recognize that over the years the CCA appears to behave like a secret society (Stonecutters perhaps?), and make decisions in dark rooms without any transparency, but I like to think that's not always the case.

One item I failed to stress on the podcast was my displeasure at fines if players make public remarks about relegation. That doesn't feel like freedom of speech to me. I hope once the event is over, players are allowed to share their feelings and not fear any retribution.

And the debate rolls on...

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Registered: Mar 2013
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They aren't evil but they absolutely have their own agenda, with or without the approval of their members. For the most part they are just like politicians, the will do anything and say anything to get on the board.... and the do anything and say anything to stay there. And you are correct that they are secretive, how else can it be explained nobody in the country other than the chosen few, or chosen 12 or so, knew relegation was being voted on?

If anyone out there has a link to the minutes of these meetings where the vote was taking place, I urge you to post a link for all to see. The first vote that is, not the coerced second vote.

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Registered: Mar 2005
Location: St. Albert
Posts: 839

Strange that Warren (in the video) mentions he doesn't remember which provinces/territories voted against. Why didn't he just say he's not at liberty to share that information? Hard to believe he can't remember. If not, then it might be time to retire...

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Registered: Sep 2002
Location: London, Ontario
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The voting on this process took place in 2009 and 2010, so some time has passed.

If you're looking for more information on it, you should be able to find it in the CCA and Provincial Association minutes.

You may need to request those from the associations, but they're supposed to be published as public record. I found references in several provincial meetings, but nothing too in-depth.

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Registered: Mar 2011
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Yukon did not support the motion. The MA's were required to accept or reject a 5 page operational implementation plan that had a pile of things in it. The document was authored by CCA and introduced the Team Canada concept. The proposals to consider 5 sheets, more than 12 teams, pools, etc. were all shot down by the operational people.

The wording of the motion was: "That the implementation process for access to national curling championships approved at the 2010 AGM continue to be initiated with the Canadian Womens Curling Championship (STOH)and Canadian Mens Curling Championship(Brier) including the team Canada concept for both events as per the operational implementation plan presented by the CCA senior staff."

So the crafty wording of the motion, especially the last part of the last sentence gave no room for MA input. This was researched and presented by the operational group of CCA.

We had to push really hard to not have relegation take place for Juniors at the same meeting. CCA was proposing relegation for the young group. Could you imagine how harsh that would have been to those kids. Talk about athlete retention.

I am listening to the interview while writing this and feel that Warren Hanson underestimates the spectators. 5 sheets is too busy for the spectators, too crowded for TV. Well I don't buy any of that.

I could go on and on, but am worried I will get fined.

Gerry, your facts are wrong as well. Last year Yukon competed. I competed. We lost to Jamie in Whitehorse. We had 4 teams at the Yukon level last year with 2 competing against Koe and Skauge. This year Yukon had 6 teams in our Yukon Championship. Also, you did sound very biased through this whole interview with Warren.

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Registered: Sep 2002
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quote:

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Originally posted by yukonboy
Gerry, your facts are wrong as well. Last year Yukon competed. I competed. We lost to Jamie in Whitehorse. We had 4 teams at the Yukon level last year with 2 competing against Koe and Skauge. This year Yukon had 6 teams in our Yukon Championship.

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Registered: Mar 2011
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An increase in interest for sure. YCA has continued to put effort in supporting competitive curling, but is unable to support it financially for the teams. Teams don't balk at playdown registration provided that there is not the OMG we just qualified to go to NWT, now where do we get the $6000 to compete?

CC wants the Brier and Scotties to qualify the best teams to rep Canada at the worlds. That is what it should be doing. But, it also has to serve as a development ground for Team Kean this year, for Team Jacobs in 2008, 09, etc. It is part of the reason that Team Gushue did well in the 06 trials. It is why Jamie Koe one year finishes 4th and this year not 4th. His team is not much different.

If we don't have access to these events to participate in, watch the negative impact. I welcome all interested Competitive Curlers who have a dream to compete Nationally and play at an awesome facility to move up. Awesome place to live!

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What I'm about to say might be misconstrued as being off-topic but bear with me...there are some websites dedicated to our friends in Nunavut. Yukonboy, you might be able to back me up on this, but the cost of living (especially things like basic groceries) is dramatically higher "up there" than it is "down here". I'm really not sure that enough people "down here" appreciate just how big a territory Nunavut really is. Given that, as well as the lack of what we "down here" would call an effective/economical way to travel from one place to another, it's understandable that curling may not be at the top of everybody/anybody's list of things to do. That's one reason that you won't always see an entry from Nunavut-but with the current system in place I can guarantee that you'll NEVER see an entry.
Yukonboy, are the teams that are "relegated" expected to stick around for the closing ceremonies? I would find that a little insulting, but maybe that's just me.
If the CCA's mandate is to increase interest and develop the game in Canada (and by "Canada", I'm thinking Coast-to-Coast-TO COAST", they appear to be going back-asswards.
I've done lots of "preaching" about why the Scotties/Brier are, and should be different from a regular stop on the pro circuit. Why the CCA manages to accommodate everybody at the junior level-and have both championships in one week-yet can't manage to do the same thing at the "Showcase Events" makes one shake their head.

BTW-has there ever been a Brier with as many "Circus Shots"? The "Hacker Double" is fading away!

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Registered: Mar 2011
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When we had to travel to Yellowknife to compete, the distance equivalent is Vancouver to Winnipeg. For fly in communities, yes costs are high for everything. BUT there are the Jordan Tootoo's still out there. The core of boys that have been going to Junior Nationals may just be able to use our sport in a personally positive way. One of them runs their junior program and the first day he had 40 kids show up. He didn't know what to do! Both having our best teams rep Canada and using sport for the improvement of our society are equally important. I know what I think is a success to me!

The CWG's just ended in Prince George. Yukon won 8 medals including 3 gold. We have a total population of 35,000. Without National Championships and Major games, that would not happen. That is one medal for every 4500 people. If Ontario had that ratio, Ontario would have won 2800 medals. When there are opportunities, good things happen, when they are taken away...

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Registered: Mar 2011
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quote:

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Originally posted by Jimbobogie

Yukonboy, are the teams that are "relegated" expected to stick around for the closing ceremonies? I would find that a little insulting, but maybe that's just me.
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