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M: USA Curling Junior National Championships
Eau Claire, WI
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Draw: M7 -- Thu, Mar 28 -- 8:00pm CT
Lannoye Final
Hebert (10) Watch Live Curling!
Fitzgerald 10th
Cenzalli  Watch Live Curling!
Brenden Final
Church (9) Watch Live Curling!
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Rose (6) Watch Live Curling!
W: USA Curling Junior National Championships
Eau Claire, WI
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Draw: W6 -- Thu, Mar 28 -- 4:00pm CT
Berg Final
Scheel (10) Watch Live Curling!
Berg Final
Schapman (10) Watch Live Curling!
Giroux 10  Final
Pekowitz (9) Watch Live Curling!
Viau Final
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M: Canadian Mixed Doubles Curling Championship
Fredericton, NB
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Draw: CF -- Fri, Mar 22 -- 1:00pm AT
Lott/Lott Final
Walk/Muyr (8) Watch Live Curling!
M: Swiss Junior Championships
Thun, SUI
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Draw: CF2 -- Sun, Mar 24 -- 3:00am ET
Caccivio Final
Brauchli 12  (EE)
Dryburgh Final
Ringgenberg (9)
W: Swiss Junior Championships
Thun, SUI
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Draw: CF2 -- Sun, Mar 24 -- 9:00am CET
Schwaller Final
Oberson (9)
Blackham Final
von Arx (9)
W: NWTCA Curling Club Championships
Fort Smith, NT
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Draw: 3 -- Sat, Mar 23 -- 11:00am MT
Stroeder Final
Delorey (7)
M: NWTCA Curling Club Championships
Fort Smith, NT
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: 3 -- Sat, Mar 23 -- 1:00pm ET
Delorey Final
Lockhart (EE)
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01-26-15 01:16PM
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jhcurl
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Men's Nationals

Teams

Men

Heath McCormick Chris Plys Joe Polo Colin Hufman Ryan Brunt
Craig Brown Kroy Nernberger Sean Beighton Jared Zezel Alex Leichter
John Shuster Tyler George Matt Hamilton John Landsteiner
Korey Dropkin Tom Howell Mark Fenner Andrew Stopera Luc Violette
Brandon Corbett Derek Corbett Paul Lyttle Jared Wydysh
Dean Gemmell Bill Stopera Martin Sather Mark Lazar
Brady Clark Greg Persinger Philip Tilker Matt Birklid
Mark Haluptzok Josh Bahr Aaron Wald Jon Chandler
Paul Pustovar Chris Bond Sam Galey Duane Rutan
Ethan Meyers Quinn Evenson Steven Szemple William Pryor

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01-26-15 03:01PM
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So which of these teams can actually go to Worlds if they were to win? And what other teams would have to fare badly to allow that to happen. And which of these teams will be ending their seasons regardless of how they do at Nationals?

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01-26-15 04:49PM
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steveneger
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McCormick wins because of Plys. You read it here first.

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01-26-15 05:00PM
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quote:
Originally posted by dbsdbs
So which of these teams can actually go to Worlds if they were to win? And what other teams would have to fare badly to allow that to happen. And which of these teams will be ending their seasons regardless of how they do at Nationals?


In the unlikely event that Brazil does win either or both challenges, will that effectively end the season for the winner?

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01-26-15 05:06PM
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rbi
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Thanks for posting the list. The full lists, including coaches, can also be found here: http://www.teamusa.org/USA-Curling/...Qualified-Teams

Someone, please post (here and in the women's thread) some information about how each team qualified for nationals. Was it through tour points, exemption, challenge round, etc. The rules for qualifying have become more complex, and it's hard to tell precisely why each of these teams is in.

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01-26-15 06:21PM
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dbsdbs, that is a difficult question (believe it or not) to answer until the end of the Ontario Men's Tankard.

How many points will be available to award the winner could hinge on Craig Brown remaining in the Top 25. While it currently looks like a good chance, some very good Ontario teams would have to fall flat in order to avoid passing Craig. I don't know if there are points available in Russia next weekend for Brownie and The Misfits.

As for how they all got there:

Face Shuster is points.

Heater McCormick, Craig Brown and Korey Dropkin are combinations of HPP byes and points.

Corbett, Gemmell, Clark and Haluptzuk are through the Challenge Round.

Meyers is through their Junior gold.

Ben Tucker

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01-26-15 08:53PM
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misty1
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I think a lot of people have been waiting for plys to make a move on tour for a while now. he's been the best junior mens team the US has had in a long time(obviously) and so im sure after his world junior gold and bronze the US set high hopes for him.

think the final 4 here will be mccormick, shuster, brown and clark.

dark horse is haluptzok

interested to see how dropkin does. he has beaten a few of the teams here this season

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01-27-15 12:07AM
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IMWright
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quote:
Originally posted by tuck
dbsdbs, that is a difficult question (believe it or not) to answer until the end of the Ontario Men's Tankard.

How many points will be available to award the winner could hinge on Craig Brown remaining in the Top 25. While it currently looks like a good chance, some very good Ontario teams would have to fall flat in order to avoid passing Craig. I don't know if there are points available in Russia next weekend for Brownie and The Misfits.

As for how they all got there:

Face Shuster is points.

Heater McCormick, Craig Brown and Korey Dropkin are combinations of HPP byes and points.

Corbett, Gemmell, Clark and Haluptzuk are through the Challenge Round.

Meyers is through their Junior gold.

Ben Tucker



Pustovar through via the Challenge Round also.

My support is for Clark, then Corbett, Shuster, Gemmell, Haluptzuk, Meyers, and Pustovar in no particular order. Oh, and then I suppose the HPP teams.

Given OOM points, I'm not sure if any non-HP team but Shuster has a shot of going to Worlds, unless Clark wins and gets some help with other teams doing poorly (correct me if I'm wrong)? So, I may throw my support/hopes onto Shuster and Clark for going to Worlds.

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01-27-15 10:14AM
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Tuck-What OOM standings are you looking at? No chance that the Men's or Women's Nationals will meet the requirements to double the points available. Right now Shuster is 22, McCormick 25, Brown 28. Clark is 32 but unlike last year we won't have a 5th team in the top 50.

Points in Russia. 4 end games, outdoors, so yes there will be points. If you want to know why you should ask Gerry. Same reason there was points for the Curling Night exhibition. Side note-as it stands now if Brown and McCormick meet in the final McCormick goes to Worlds regardless because the Curling Night points put him more than 10 in front of Brown.

Who can make it to worlds? Right now every team there has a chance. Some just need lots of help. Shuster and McCormick are the only 2 Men's teams that control their own destiny. Win and they're in. Brown needs to win and not play Shuster or McCormick in the final. Clark needs to win and not play Brown and have Shuster and McCormick not in the top 3 (Russia could change that, he might need Brown out of top 3 too).

Every other team needs Shuster, McCormick, and Brown out of the top 3. A couple also need Clark in 3rd or worse.

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01-27-15 12:33PM
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Got to love that fight for 3rd place

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01-27-15 12:41PM
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Asking me to explain myself on points? Dang, I ain't near that good.

My remedial understanding is that there are certainly 15 points available for the gold medalist to collect and pass other teams. However, if certain playdowns far away break just right, there might be more points available.

Said another way: If enough USA teams are highly rated in the WCT standings, our National Championships are worth more points. As much as many of us (myself included) like to point out the shortcoming of the current HPP and the paths taken by the USCA and USOC, getting highly ranked WCT teams is a significant accomplishment that cannot go ignored.

Hope that clarifies my thinking and partial understanding. Perhaps someone with a deeper knowledge can fill in the holes.

Ben Tucker

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01-27-15 04:08PM
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jhcurl
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Here is the explanation of the points awarded at Nats and what counts.
http://www.teamusa.org/USA-Curling/...coming-Team-USA

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01-27-15 07:04PM
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Alice
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quote:
Originally posted by MNIceman


Points in Russia. 4 end games, outdoors, so yes there will be points. If you want to know why you should ask Gerry. Same reason there was points for the Curling Night exhibition. Side note-as it stands now if Brown and McCormick meet in the final McCormick goes to Worlds regardless because the Curling Night points put him more than 10 in front of Brown.

Who can make it to worlds? Right now every team there has a chance. Some just need lots of help. Shuster and McCormick are the only 2 Men's




Points, Russia, outdoors?! Red Square Classic, Jan 29 - Feb 2, 2015. No idea which teams have been invited for this year. New to OOM point land this year?

Last year it was men only, teams from a Moscow, Scotland, Russian Jr National, Switzerland, St Petersburg, Canada, Czech Republic, Denmark. 6 end games with 2 extra tiebreaker ends, most games played to just 4 ends.

What will happen next year with the get-points/made-for-TV events like the Red Square match and USA Curling Night? Will any be open to any teams on the OOM list? Just open to national teams? Would the TV Food Network show a curl + broomstacking pro-am? How about curling-petanque on the new Chicago Ice Ribbon?

(I see the rolling eyeballs...). But, remember how the 1960s/70s TV specials with Peggy Fleming skating outdoors with skier Jean Claude Killy in Sun Valley, Idaho and the Bolshoi Ballet in Russia popularized competitive ice skating in the USA. Antiques Roadshow with a curling stone-shaped hot whisky toddy kettle in use after an outdoor match? Glynhill Ladies has one for its trophy already. (Does Laphroiag whisky still sponsor USCA?) Outdoor curling on the lake at Beijing's Summer Palace? Rideau Canal? We will all have to be creative in this new race for TV shows with OOM points.

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01-28-15 01:21PM
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OK, let's get this baby started. Time to post Da Line (copyright Bill Morehouse). This year's odds are going to make NO sense at all. We at Wicks Picks need to protect ourselves and discourage y'all from loading up on Face, Brady and Heater...so we'll be giving you crap odds on those teams. Brownie fans will get a fair shake. Corbett backers thinking that they're going to get Double Digit odds on a team that they've noticed has beaten some really top teams this year underestimate us at Wicks Picks. Value bettors will get their carrot tempted them to bet the mortgage money with the Feel Good Story Haluptzok team.

You're all suckers. NEVER bet on curling. (unless you are Tuck...then bet the fillies and keep betting them until Morehouse and Rouhonen owe you their first-born...which both of them do by now)

Long post...might split this up:

Heater McCormick: 2 to 1 Team started the year so badly that I thought Heater had some sort of advanced college degree like a PhD or MBA...only a Canadian one that read DNQ. OUCH! LIneup changes and hot/cold Heater switching to Hot mode and they cash in The National Slam. Dang! Still, their recent results are showing those pesky DNQ letters again. Vulnerable favorite.

John Shuster: 5 to 2 Face and Face Team actually belong closer to 3/1 or 4/1, but we're afraid of people betting with their hearts. Remember the words of Willy The Wise: Bet with your head, not over it. Face Fanatics will be betting Schuster. Ty George fans will be betting. Hammy fans will be betting. OK, Landsteiner has no fans, but he's a really really good lead. Mostly, those who are NOT fans of the HPP will be all over this team...hence the stingy odds. Cashed early and often (pretty much any spiel sponsored by Stu Sells), then a cold streak. Coming back to life of as late including a win over Heater in The Open.

Craig Brown: 4 to 1 Great team, great skip, great recent National round robins...when does being snake bit in the Men's playoffs stop being an unfortunate streak and start being a predictable trend? It's not the pressure...that much I know for sure. Permanent curse from some curling gods? Cashed in 7 of 9 events and that's sayin' somethin'. Probably the best betting value I'm going to give you.

Mike Farbelow: 5 to 1 The pairing with Doctor Double seems to have been a license to cash checks. 3 for 5 cashing in spiels with 2 championships. Now them's some good numbers. Hot of late with a Curl Mesabi title and decent showing in the US Open. WHAT? They're not playing??? They were going to be my pick! Not playing? Seriously?

More teams very soon.

Ben Tucker
I miss Willy

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01-28-15 01:53PM
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Brady Clark: 6 to 1 If this team holds true to 2014/2015 form, they will play 2 very good games and then stink up the rest. Still, he's Brady Clark and he has a very good supporting cast (except I'm not certain that Tilker will be going to Kalamazoo unless the points are available for the winner to get the Worlds spot). 1 cash in 7 events...lots and lots of Win 2 Lose 3 types of weekends. Granted, they generally were very tough events. Probably belongs around 9 to 1, but Brady and The Brady Bunch are among the most popular teams in the USA and Brady is probably our most popular curler now that some of the gals are sitting out the year. So this Scrooge is going to take advantage of the rare coupling Popular/Crap Year and take your money while offering you less-than-generous odds. You want charity? Go to church.

Brandon Corbett: 6 to 1 Wise guys have been waiting to pounce on this team thinking that, "Tuck's an idiot. He doesn't really pay attention." Well, you're half right, but I do pay attention. 2 for 4 on the Ontario tour with 1 championship. Just hot early and an Eastie team without staying power? Wrong. Check the linescores from the Seattle Challenge Round. Their average lead after 7 ends was 5 points and that includes games against Clark and Stolt.

Dean Gemmell: 10 to 1 Heater's front end sans Heater, they started off the year so bad that the gasoline they burned traveling was a waste of money and an insult to the environment. Then they bring in Lazar. Then they start to come to life at the Curl Mesabi Cash. Then they look really good at the Challenge Round (except for letting Haluptzok back into a game that should have over...probably just keeping up the Heater tradition of playing offense like a NBA All Star game but also playing defense like a NBA All Star game) going undefeated. They got the chops. They got long odds. You like their chances? Ain't the worst bet on the board by a long way.

Crap. 3 more teams? Where's Willy? Where's Dr. Double?

Ben Tucker

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01-28-15 02:30PM
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Korey Dropkin: 10 to 1 (OK, I had them at 7 to 1 but forgot to put them in before Gemmell) Dropkin The Younger started off the year ripping up older teams and leaving them for dead. Lately? Not so much. Both skip and third were very good in Devils Lake, but not the GREAT that we've grown accustomed to from them. That's a shame, because Little Stop and Fenner were playing extremely well. Will they have a chip on their shoulders from the "bad beat"? (it wasn't really a bad beat) I don't know, but they've been contenders all year long no matter what age group they've been playing in. Now I don't want any of you taking advantage of the inflated odds just because I accidently skipped over them. They belong at 7 to 1. Getting 10 to 1 is simply taking advantage of Your Old Friend Tuck...and that would just be plain wrong.



Mark Haluptzok: 12 to 1 If Brady has competition for the title of Beloved, it's probably He's Gotta Be Fricken' 80 Years Old Haluptzok. Mark has been a nice guy and a class act since the day he was born...which, if I'm not mistaken, was the same day Lee surrendered to Grant at the Appomattox court house. Mark throws lead and skips. Doing the heavy lifting are the duo of Bahr (skip's stones) and The Wonderful Waldo (third's rocks). Unlike most of us geezers, Mark has always liked and respected the power peel game when done appropriately and only at the appropriate times. That makes this team mesh despite the generational gap. Not that it was easy. Mediocre start to the year, but they looked very good in Duluth...followed that up with a pretty good Eveleth showing...then looked good getting a B Spot out of the Challenge Round. Great story, but should you be betting the rent money on a great story? Truthfully, I do find them a good sneaky longshot. They are trending the right way and Wald/Bahr aren't that far removed from Junior gold.

Paul Pustovar: 14 to 1 Pusty has been playing some but not with great results. New team, but it's nice to see that Rutan is back. I like him. Will Pusty add to his collection that makes him the most decorated curler in US Curling history? I don't think so, but feel free to bet it.

Ethan Meyers: 14 to 1 Earned a spot by winning Junior gold over the HPP Junior team. Great finals. Might make some of you True Believers. Me? I think it's a good team with good developing talent and a true skip. Still, I've seen this movie before. Plys was World gold when they went to Denver Nationals and didn't do that well. Other Junior teams like Blake Morton have impressed us by making the field but didn't hit the medal stand. We do tend to love our Junior teams each and every year. Still, they did look good in the gold medal game and weren't bad during the round robin. But against the likes of Heater, Face, Brownie and a Dropkin rink that may think that they owe Meyers one??? It's your money...but if you're betting with your heart, then don't bet the grocery money.

Peter Stolt: 99 to 1 They've been the Bubble Team waiting to see the outcome of Juniors. I imagine when Dropkin The Younger's double attempt skidded past the shot rock by the width of a paper, Pete may have cussed a little...even though we both probably liked Meyers chances of making the draw. Stolt is still in the running because I'm not all that sure the other teams will show up. I have heard of teams (plural) that were considering not taking time off work and going to the expense of Kalamazoo unless the points thing allowed for the winner to be our Worlds team. I've also heard one team thinking about declining just to make a point. I'll tell you this: If Stolt does find a backdoor to Kalamazoo, I like what I've been seeing in Brad Caldwell at third. They could be dangerous.

Have fun with it. Place your bets. My pick to follow later.

Ben Tucker

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01-28-15 03:56PM
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Got a problem here, the mighty Plainsfield (tm Tuck) has players on three teams. So need to throw one out and that will be Meyers. Dropkin the younger and the Ducklings in the final. Dropkin goes to Worlds after going all Tanya Harding on Face, Heater and Brownie before the playoffs start.

Not allowed to bet on Juniors, besides Tuck already owes me enough.

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01-28-15 04:29PM
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Brown over Face in the finals.

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01-28-15 06:02PM
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Prop Bet: Will the Finals determine who gets to go to Worlds? House thinks YES so will pay 2 to 1 if you think NO.

Ben Tucker

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01-28-15 06:44PM
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Time for my pick:

The brain is screaming Heater McCormick. Semi finals in a Slam does tend to influence one's thinking. He's got the USCA's Golden Child at third. Plys has yet to convert on all of the talent shown when winning medals at World Juniors, but let's not forget: With the possible exception of Craig Brown during the round robin, Chris Plys was the best curler at Nationals in Philly last year. After Chris and Craig, you'd have to cross over to the Women's and consider Lil Miss Hammy...but I digress. Chris Plys was very, very good in Philly.

Heater also has Joe Polo. ALL of us (including the USCA and USOC) are huge Joe Cool fans...including me...especially me.

Still, Heater and The Hotties haven't exactly been lighting it up lately. Yeah, the convincing win over Glenn Howard at The National blew us all away...but we learned in the following 30 days that lots of teams can beat Glenn Howard now. (no disrespect...he's still the Glenn Howard and I very much am not) Bottomline: Do I really want to bet my "sugar beets and potatoes" on Heath McCormick MBA CPA DNQ?

Craig Brown seems to make much more sense. Much more consistent over the year. Seems to curling better of late. Good team in front of him. Absolutely a stud through 9 games of the round robin and the Page 1v2 in Philly. But, dang, that final game was bad. I mean BAD. For that one day if Craig was your lead in Sunday Night Mixed league, you'd have been pissed off. Still, they've cashed a lot of checks this year. It's not a function of pressure. Brownie has made more big shots than most of us ever get to throw. His split for 2 against Pusty in the Ogden Nationals gold medal game was one of the ballsiest calls and coldest throws I've ever seen. Brownie is due.

I'm not likin' Brady's chances this year and that pains me because I love Brady (just like most of us do). My spies tell me that his back pain has lessened and his release is getting back to true. Still, not a great year. Lineup? Nope. He's had success with Persinger before. Burnout? Nope. Not the way Brady loves the game. That would be like us normal humans burning out on food or water or air to breath, such is Brady's love of the game. I don't know the problem, but even with a terribly tough schedule as an excuse...I think there is a problem. Now maybe Tilker will bow out of Kalamazoo? That ain't good.

Corbett's got a shot. They'll need a good round robin and they'll HAVE to get into the Page 1v2. Teams may mistakenly take them lightly in the round robin, but not in the playoffs. They'll need that 1v2 edge is they are to have a shot at gold.

Dropkin The Younger...DTY from now on or maybe Ditty...has a shot. They have to get back to November form on the back end while keeping current form for the front two. They'll have to rebound from narrowly missing (no pun intended) their goal of Junior National gold and World Junior podium...not an easy thing to rebound from. All of that needs to get done, but that can get done...if they really and deeply want it to get done.

I think Gemmell and The Ducklings have a legit shot at the podium. Gold would surprise me. Same for that dinosaur skipping Bahr/Wald. For those who have never met that dinosaur, try to do so. Mark is not only only of the greatest guys I've met in curling, he is one of the greatest guys I've met in life.

I'm not seeing medals for either Pusty or Meyers. I will concede that either or both would be wicked cool. I hope they prove me wrong. The Finals at Juniors was a brilliant game, but it was (by far) their best game of the week. That's the game the young Meyers team will have to bring almost every time out in Kalamazoo. Pustovar's team seemed to come together a little better every game in Seattle. Bond was impressive. Galey did well. Rutan was very, very good. Probably a good thing that they took the long path through the C event because games might be just what they needed.

Ben Tucker
Hoping nobody takes offense

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01-28-15 07:06PM
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tuck
Super Rockchucker

 

Registered: Dec 2005
Location: St. Thomas, North Dakota
Posts: 2613

That leaves us with the elephant in the room:

From my limited exposure, I'm going to suggest that many dislike the HPP. Not that we don't like the individual curlers. Who doesn't like Heater, Joe Cool, Brownie, Lil Miss Hammy, Jamie Sinclair, etc...? Nope, it's more that our sensibilities are rubbed the wrong way when our National champions are not sent to Worlds. It's more that our sense of fair play is offended when Points are a big factor and some teams are financially supported getting Points and given opportunities for Points that are not available to all teams.

I think, because of this, many of us are going to be openly and loudly cheering for Shuster. Face's Foursome has the points to make it to Worlds outside of the HPP and it looks like they'll probably be the only team that has earned that position. I believe that the others have to hope that Heater and Brownie finish outside of the Top 3...as well as Team Shuster...and I don't see that happening.

I will admit, I'm going to be one of those cheering for Face. He's easy to cheer for, but there are lots and lots of guys in this field that are easy to cheer for and some of them are friends. But should I pick Team Shuster?

Most of you know about The Curse Of Tuck. While I am pretty accurate in the Women's, my track record in Men's is so bad it seems my selections are doomed to fail. There is one exception, however. Shuster has beaten The Curse Of Tuck before and I think he's going to do it again. Shuster is my pick.

I predict that Face will beat Brownie in the Finals. I predict that Craig will be very, very good in the Finals and that John will have to make something fantastic to beat him...but John will make something fantastic and Shuster will edge Brown for the gold.

Ben Tucker

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01-29-15 10:14AM
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AlanMacNeill
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Posts: 1064

I'm putting my entire mortgage payment on *NO HPP TEAM* making the finals.

(note =...I rent, so I don't actually *have* a mortgage...)

I just want to watch the apoplexy when it happens.

And eat popcorn, lots of popcorn.

AS for an actual pick, give me Shuster over Corbett and a "makes the playoffs" tease for our Junior Champions.

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01-29-15 10:38AM
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Norse Curler
Harvey Hacksmasher

 

Registered: Jan 2015
Location: United States
Posts: 19

New at this........Shuster over McCormick in EE in final(6to5).

__________________
Norse Curler
SKOL

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01-29-15 12:20PM
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VAcurler
Hitting Paint

 

Registered: Jan 2012
Location:
Posts: 136

Not sure who I'm picking yet (but I'm rooting for the Easties including the Junior HPP team). I can't decide if seeing Craig Brown smile by winning would be more fun than having an all nickname Face vs. Duck final.

I will put my money that we'll know who is going to worlds before the first rock is thrown in the championship game.

The more interesting prop bet is the over/under line on total points scored in the final. If its double digits, I'll take the under.

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01-29-15 02:28PM
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tuck
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Registered: Dec 2005
Location: St. Thomas, North Dakota
Posts: 2613

We'll wait to see the participants, but I'm sure the over/under will excede 9 points. Heater, Brownie, Brady, Face, Cool Hand Corbett and the Fabulous Farbs all start smiling when they think of rocks in play. (Dang it. I keep forgetting Marathon Mike Farbelow ain't playin' this year. But he's got such a good year going! How about that for a nickname finals: Marathon Mike vs Face? The wonderful Farbs/Shoostie exacta box?)

I had the night to sleep on it and the brain is still insisting on Heater. If they can get semi's in a Slam, they should be able to grab gold when they wake up and focus in. Still, I can't shake the poor recent results. Perhaps the "gift" of Chris Plys is a gift that cuts both ways. All the talent in the world, but he can also be surly. How supportive a teammate is he when he's not in the house? I have no idea. Still, props for the big check out of The National. I just think with Heater and Joe Cool the results should be better. So I'm silencing my brain (not hard to do...it's not like it's a megawatt powerhouse) and sticking with my picks.

Let me be clear: My heart does want a nonHPP team to win, but my heart is totally rooted in USA curling. Whomever wins...or even advances to Worlds without the gold...will get my total support. We can NEVER send off a team to Worlds allowing them to feel that they are less than worthy. The selection process was in place before the first rocks were thrown way back in August. Whomever advances will do so under those rules and are totally worthy of representing our nation with my (and hopefully everybodies) total support.

JH taking some long odds. He's ain't bettin' and that one would take some time to pay off...if it comes in.

Norse is new to this, but is going for Extra Credit by declaring an extra end and the final score. If he nails it, let's all credit it to Beginners Luck and hold off on crowning him the new Nostradamus.

Ben Tucker

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