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M: Canadian Mixed Doubles Curling Championship
Fredericton, NB
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: 6 -- Mon, Mar 18 -- 7:00pm AT
Gagn/Mori Final
Rees/Ches (EE)
Sand/Crai Final
Gamb/Kalt (8)
Arms/Grif Final
Pete/Gall (7) Watch Live Curling!
Zhen/Piet Final
Gion/Desj (7)
Wasy/Koni Final
Jone/Lain (EE)
Wise/Smit 12  Final
Weag/Eppi (6)
Lott/Lott 12  Final
Bouc/Char (7)
Krev/Math Final
Whit/Whit (6)
M: Aberdeen International Curling Championship
Aberdeen, SCO
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: CF -- Sun, Mar 17 -- 2:45pm GMT
Mouat Final
Shuster (7)
W: Biktrix Saskatchewan Senior Women's Curling Championship
Martensville, SK
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: CF -- Sun, Mar 17 -- 3:00pm MT
Foster Final
Streifel (8) Watch Live Curling!
W: CCAA / Curling Canada College Championships
Sudbury, ON
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: CF -- Sat, Mar 16 -- 2:30pm AT
Southern Alberta IoT Final
Concordia U (10)
UofA - Augustana Final
Humber College (10)
D: WCT Slovakia Mixed Doubles Cup II
Bratislava, SVK
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: CF -- Sun, Mar 17 -- 12:00pm CET
Han/Zou Final
Paul/Paul (7)
Cihl/Mace Final
Yang/Tian 10  (6)
: NWTCA Mixed
Yellowknife, NT
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: 4 -- Sun, Mar 17 -- 10:00am MT
Delorey Final
Koe (5)
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03-26-14 04:01PM
tuck is offline Click Here to See the Profile for tuck Click here to Send tuck a Private Message Find more posts by tuck Add tuck to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
tuck
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Registered: Dec 2005
Location: St. Thomas, North Dakota
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World Men's 2014

Some thought that World Women's was a softer field than most years because some of the Olympic teams sat that one out. The Men's field seems pretty stout to me.

Canada sends Koe and they'll be tough. Jamie King is the 5th and might outdrink the other 5ths as well.

China was very good in Sochi and might just be great at home.

Are the Czechs still stinging from missing the Olympics? Have they thrown much since that loss to Shuster? We know they can play, but I don't see them rebounding from Fussen.

Denmark was mediocre in Sochi and I think that might continue. They have gotten hot at Worlds a couple of times and this might be one of those times.

Germany earned a Sochi spot on home ice and then came out flat. I don't see them moving up now, but I could be wrong.

Japan just gets better and better. Close to home, they might really break through here. They've played a tough schedule for 2 years and it might pay off.

Ulsrud comes from Norway with the pants. Everybody will be picking them to medal...except me.

Russia looked good in Sochi. This ain't Sochi.

Scotland sends Ewan MacDonald to give us a break from the Murdoch/Brewster teams. They know it is not an Olympic Points year and some of their other curlers are getting a chance for some international exposure. That bombed in this year's Women's Worlds...I think this team is going to shine at Men's.

Sweden sends their B Squad as Edin sits this one out. This is an extremely good B Squad.

Switzerland sends their A Team. de Cruz can flat out play and Schwarz has nerves of steel throwing the last rocks. Great team. The Swiss forces their teams to win it on the ice. Worked great for the Women...I think this is the year of the Swiss and maybe the start of them being a powerhouse.

Pizza Pete goes for the USA. They have a little unfinished business at Worlds. Their last appearance was not pretty. Joe Cool, Ski and Rhino Brunt are throwing 'em great. I love Pete's chances.

I like Canada, China, Japan, Scotland, Sweden, Switzerland and the USA. I can't always pick Canada, so give me China over the Swiss for gold and silver...gimme Pete over the Swedes for the bronze.

Ben Tucker

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03-26-14 04:45PM
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jhcurl
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Registered: Sep 2002
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I think Tuck posted earlier that he was wrong and he is wrong again. Twice in one day, go back to growing sugar beets.

The OOM YTD predicted the women's world finish at least through the first six spots, US taking sixth. So, went to the OOM for the men. Swiss team is the 3rd best of the Hoppe Suisse, so not a repeat of the women. Here are the final four - Koe, Ulsrud, Liu, Fenson. I see Ulsrud losing the 1-2 game to Koe, then beating Fenson in the semi and winning gold over Koe. Fenson wins the bronze.

The "pants" finally break through and win, then retire. Team Koe disbands and builds toward the 2018 Olys (already posted everywhere).

JH
Tuck is wrong at least 20 times a day (ask his wife)

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03-26-14 06:04PM
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tuck
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Registered: Dec 2005
Location: St. Thomas, North Dakota
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True, I am wrong at least 20 times a day. Then again, because I never shut up, that makes my batting average around .655. Not bad.

Why is JH ripping on me every day? I bought him drinks. I'm going to buy him drinks again in July.

JH bores us all with his mathematical selections. Heck, we have Gerry and Dallas and ThirdNerd for to make us yawn. I need to pick a longshot from time to time.

So how about it, Jeffy? Got a longshot for us or are you saving that for The Derby? Actually, Norway is a medium shot. You're covered.

Tuck

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03-29-14 10:02AM
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jhcurl
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Registered: Sep 2002
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We are underway. Bad numbers for US in the first game, team shoots 69%. The ice looks suspect at this point. Lots of picks and wild curl. TSN was talking about carpet fibers and bad water. Hopefully Hans and the crew will get it better.

Better numbers in game two but another loss. Watched the shot by shot. Pete had a tough runback onto two frozen stones to score two and win. Hit it wrong and jammed the wrong stone.

Tough start, need to bounce back tomorrow.

JH

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03-29-14 10:04AM
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misty1
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I watched shot by shot curlit so im not sure if im seeing things wrong but to me it looked like pete could have used oskar's own guard to run back and he'd still get 2 out of it.
I guess maybe the angles were different then what was shown because I think he chose the harder of the from what I could see.

I still think the US can make a run for playoffs. Yeah a bad start but I think theyre good enough and experienced enough where they wont let it get to them

the only bad thing is that now they'll definitely need a win over one of Canada, china or norway

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03-29-14 05:15PM
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Nine Ender
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quote:
Originally posted by misty1
I watched shot by shot curlit so im not sure if im seeing things wrong but to me it looked like pete could have used oskar's own guard to run back and he'd still get 2 out of it.
I guess maybe the angles were different then what was shown because I think he chose the harder of the from what I could see.

I still think the US can make a run for playoffs. Yeah a bad start but I think theyre good enough and experienced enough where they wont let it get to them

the only bad thing is that now they'll definitely need a win over one of Canada, china or norway



This is a familiar pattern, misty and tuck predicting a US playoff spot based on "experience" and a veteran US team missing the playoffs. Nothing about recent history suggests they were anything more then long shots to do well at this event.

Last edited by Nine Ender on 03-29-14 at 06:14PM

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03-29-14 06:56PM
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misty1
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quote:
Originally posted by Nine Ender


This is a familiar pattern, misty and tuck predicting a US playoff spot based on "experience" and a veteran US team missing the playoffs. Nothing about recent history suggests they were anything more then long shots to do well at this event.



Before you include me in that maybe you should get your memory checked because I haven't predicted the US men to make the playoffs in a long time.In fact last year I was in here declaring that brady clark wouldn't get close and that the US was in trouble with him as their rep while others were giving them a shot

So you see its really not a familiar pattern.

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03-29-14 07:18PM
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Nine Ender
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quote:
Originally posted by misty1


Before you include me in that maybe you should get your memory checked because I haven't predicted the US men to make the playoffs in a long time.In fact last year I was in here declaring that brady clark wouldn't get close and that the US was in trouble with him as their rep while others were giving them a shot

So you see its really not a familiar pattern.


Here is your last prediction :

quote:
Originally posted by misty1
Whether I agree with the new system (and I don't) or not I do think Allison will be one of the teams there at the end of the week. She got to tiebreaker in a much tougher fielf than this in 2012 so she can definitely do well here.

My predicted final 4 now that the US is determined is this:

Canada
United States
Sweden
Korea



Canada was the only team on this list that made top three.
That's a pattern, whether you take ownership of your ideas or not doesn't matter to me.

Last edited by Nine Ender on 03-29-14 at 07:25PM

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03-29-14 08:04PM
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misty1
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quote:
Originally posted by Nine Ender

Here is your last prediction :



Canada was the only team on this list that made top three.
That's a pattern, whether you take ownership of your ideas or not doesn't matter to me.




Ive picked the americans to make the playoffs twice. That's not a pattern, you need something to happen more than two times for it to be a pattern.

Last edited by misty1 on 03-29-14 at 08:33PM

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03-29-14 08:12PM
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hit-n-roll
Harvey Hacksmasher

 

Registered: Sep 2002
Location: McFarland, Wisconsin
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We've assumed our familiar position in the standings.

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03-30-14 01:21AM
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SPMFromPCC
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Hehe......assume the position......

I'm sorry, I couldn't resist.

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03-30-14 10:05AM
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OHCurler
Harvey Hacksmasher

 

Registered: Mar 2011
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Is there some sort of international law that the US isn't allowed to score in 10th ends?

It is what killed the women, and seems to be a problem here too.

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03-30-14 09:07PM
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VAcurler
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Is there any way to follow along with draw 6? I didn't see any games of this draw being streamed on the WCF page.

Jason

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03-30-14 11:57PM
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dbsdbs
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I "watched" last end at wmcc.curlit.com - USA down 1 coming home with hammer but got in a mess with lots of Japanese rocks in house. Looked like Pete made a great shot with his first rock to at least open things up again, but then apparently came short with his last rock draw for the tie. Japan steals 3 and USA drops to 1-3, ahead of only winless Scotland.

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03-31-14 07:54AM
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AlanMacNeill
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But wait...I thought that sending teams that had experience and seasoning from Canadian spiels guaranteed us 10-0 Round Robin Records and nothing but an everlasting stream of gold medals...

Huh...funny...you mean...you still have to play the games on the ice? That's a <bleeped> up system, everyone knows you determine the best team by their performances in multiple spiels months ago! Duh Leaders at the HPP said so, and they can't ever be wrong.

(Which reminds me...exactly how many World or Olympic Medals do the heads of our HPP program have again?)

At least Fenson actually was our National Champion, so we're spared that stupidity...

The Program ain't working, replace the heads, replace the plan, get something that actually improves the game *IN AMERICA*, not Shipping the Game out to Canada and hoping.

Outsourcing isn't a plan.

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03-31-14 08:52AM
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quote:
Originally posted by AlanMacNeill
But wait...I thought that sending teams that had experience and seasoning from Canadian spiels guaranteed us 10-0 Round Robin Records and nothing but an everlasting stream of gold medals...

Huh...funny...you mean...you still have to play the games on the ice? That's a <bleeped> up system, everyone knows you determine the best team by their performances in multiple spiels months ago! Duh Leaders at the HPP said so, and they can't ever be wrong.

(Which reminds me...exactly how many World or Olympic Medals do the heads of our HPP program have again?)

At least Fenson actually was our National Champion, so we're spared that stupidity...

The Program ain't working, replace the heads, replace the plan, get something that actually improves the game *IN AMERICA*, not Shipping the Game out to Canada and hoping.

Outsourcing isn't a plan.




It is getting so tiresome at this point. Are you sure you even like curling?

We sent the best team we had. They won Nationals. We supported them with money, training, and coaching. What about this is worth that rant?

They are almost winning games. Again, failure to convert in the 10th end dooms them. If they play these ends well, they are in a much different position, and your rant is different.

The reality is probably they are just slightly worse than a lot of these teams, and it is manifesting in 10th ends...

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03-31-14 09:04AM
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jhcurl
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Gerry has added some info to the standings list. If you look at the standings and then click on the team, it shows all the games that team will play with the OOM for the opponent. The US is 26 on the OOM. Six teams are ranked higher and 5 are lower. Team Fenson has lost to two of the lower ranked teams. So, they are doing slightly worse than expected. I would guess that one of the losses was due to the poor ice conditions.

Hopefully some of the bad breaks will even out and the US will get a win or two from them.

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03-31-14 09:21AM
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quote:


It is getting so tiresome at this point. Are you sure you even like curling?

We sent the best team we had. They won Nationals. We supported them with money, training, and coaching. What about this is worth that rant?



I love curling, and maybe that's the problem, I want to see the US Succeed...yet...the further and further the nation goes down the "professional" path, the further and further we seem to get from contention.

The path we're on is not the path to success. It needs to be changed.

Open competition to determine our best team, *then* giving that team adequate time to prepare, and the resources that entails, is a much better plan than hand-picking teams based on chicken bones and entrails while they're still Juniors, giving them free passes to Nationals once they're 21 (assuming they haven't burned out), rigging the team selection process such that only HPP teams have a chance to win, and then sending them off to Worlds less than a month later.

The time to fix the process is *now*

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03-31-14 10:59AM
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Gerry
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quote:
Originally posted by AlanMacNeill
But wait...I thought that sending teams that had experience and seasoning from Canadian spiels guaranteed us 10-0 Round Robin Records and nothing but an everlasting stream of gold medals...

Huh...funny...you mean...you still have to play the games on the ice? That's a <bleeped> up system, everyone knows you determine the best team by their performances in multiple spiels months ago! Duh Leaders at the HPP said so, and they can't ever be wrong.

(Which reminds me...exactly how many World or Olympic Medals do the heads of our HPP program have again?)

At least Fenson actually was our National Champion, so we're spared that stupidity...

The Program ain't working, replace the heads, replace the plan, get something that actually improves the game *IN AMERICA*, not Shipping the Game out to Canada and hoping.

Outsourcing isn't a plan.



Derek Brown's International Record:

MEN
2002 Worlds Bronze - Warwick Smith - list as team coach
2005 Worlds Silver - David Murdoch
2006 Worlds Gold - David Murdoch
2008 Worlds Silver - David Murdoch
2009 Worlds Gold - David Murdoch
2010 Worlds Bronze - Warwick Smith

WOMEN
2002 Olympic Gold - Rhona Martin - unsure if Derek was head of program in 2002, but was involved by that point.
2002 Worlds Gold - Jackie Lockhart
2007 Worlds Bronze - Kelly Wood
2010 Worlds Silver - Eve Muirhead

As for the program, you do realize this is not a 1-year fix? It will take several years of USA teams playing international competition. You don't get results overnight, and this year was the first that the HP staff were able to implement the season long points system.

The proof is in the rankings, for the first time USA has had 5 men's teams inside the Top 50, as well as 4 women's teams inside the Top 50 and 2 more to count 6 inside the Top 60. This is the highest number of USA teams that have ranked that highly on the Order of Merit since it was implement in 2006.

The importance of improving the Order of Merit rankings means invites to the Grand Slams, and other major Tour events in Canada where the best teams in the World compete. It also shows small steps in improvement, but there's still a lot of work to be done over the next few years.

All 3 Olympic Medal winners on the Men's side compete in the Grand Slams. The 3 Women's Olympic medalists all spend time in Canada. "Out-sourcing" seems to be working for those programs.

As for "rigging" the process, there's no such things. The door is open for anyone to go play in Canada. IF you're good enough, you'll win games and points, and along with the prize money that allows you to be self-funding.

The 2013 Canadian Brier Champions and Olympic Gold Medalists had limited funding and limited sponsorship as of 2 years ago. And they were grinding it out for several years before that without any money. They drove 6-10 hours to EVERY event they played in for 3-4 seasons before they broke-through with their Brier win.

This past season is the first one they were able to fly to all their events, as the money started to come in from the success they showed on the ice.

Team Jacobs is the perfect template for USA teams to try and match. Work hard in the gym, throw lots of practice rocks and work together on the game and get out and play. And play lots. They all worked full-time jobs to pay the bills.

They tell the story in their 2011 Far From Home video at the Grand Slam in Kingston, Ontario:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmYLbTuQ-zg

Jacobs ranked 10th overall on the Order of Merit to start that 2011/12 season:
http://www.worldcurl.com/oom/oom.ph...12&week=1&xml=1

You noticed all the sponsor logos on their shirts? err, almost NONE! They paid their way in sweat equity and winnings. If a USA team was to be in their position, they would be receiving some serious funding from the USOC to compete. And yet, Team Jacobs kept plugging away, driving to their events and EARNING IT!


The constant whining and excuses is mind-boggling. If you really want it and you're good enough, you will find a way to make it happen.

Excuses are easy. Hard work pays off.

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03-31-14 11:31AM
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AMEN Gerry!!!

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03-31-14 11:47AM
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I think what he was getting at is Derek Brown has no medals won on the ice as a curler. I suppose you could claim all the Scottish team medals while he was with their program as validation for Derek, but they seem to be doing perfectly fine (better) without him.

I'm completely not buying the "1 year fix" line. The HP program has been tinkering with the system long before this year. This year was just the most dramatic, as our National Championship was thrown away to "encourage teams to play in Canada". As if the top teams weren't playing in Canada already and know that it's the most effective way to improve.

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03-31-14 12:07PM
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At the end of the day, the teams/players that want to be the best will find a way (or make their own way) to be the best. If you don't have the time, make the time. Either it matters or it doesn't. We know the system. Either put in the work or don't. Period.

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03-31-14 12:16PM
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Back to the topic at hand. Team Fenson should have a chance to make the playoffs but need some good wins the rest of the way. Currently at 2-3 with games left against SCO, CAN, CHN, DEN, NOR, SUI. 4-2 in the last 6 could get them to a tiebreaker. I look for Norway and Canada to pull away from the field and a bunch of teams fighting it out for the 3 and 4 spots.

Certainly the ice has been an equalizer. Will be an interesting next few days.

JH

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03-31-14 05:45PM
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Discussions about decisions made are fun especially since it's impossible to know whether a different choice could have resulted in a better or worse outcome, or even not made a difference. One could argue that not making changes after 2010 could have resulted in a gold medal sweep in Sochi for the US teams, while another could argue that both US teams could have missed qualifying entirely. Neither could be proven right or wrong. Maybe that's why we're getting the same tired arguments over and over again.

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04-01-14 12:14AM
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Tough loss tonight - only 2nd win for Scotland. Now likely need to win 4 of final 5 to have chance at playoffs - and that may not even be enough. Tough order with games left vs CAN, CHN,DEN, NOR, SUI.

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Curling Scores

M: Canadian Mixed Doubles Curling Championship
Fredericton, NB
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: 6 -- Mon, Mar 18 -- 7:00pm AT
Gagn/Mori Final
Rees/Ches (EE)
Sand/Crai Final
Gamb/Kalt (8)
Arms/Grif Final
Pete/Gall (7) Watch Live Curling!
Zhen/Piet Final
Gion/Desj (7)
Wasy/Koni Final
Jone/Lain (EE)
Wise/Smit 12  Final
Weag/Eppi (6)
Lott/Lott 12  Final
Bouc/Char (7)
Krev/Math Final
Whit/Whit (6)
M: Aberdeen International Curling Championship
Aberdeen, SCO
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: CF -- Sun, Mar 17 -- 2:45pm GMT
Mouat Final
Shuster (7)
D: WCT Slovakia Mixed Doubles Cup II
Bratislava, SVK
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Draw: CF -- Sun, Mar 17 -- 12:00pm CET
Han/Zou Final
Paul/Paul (7)
Cihl/Mace Final
Yang/Tian 10  (6)
: NWTCA Mixed
Yellowknife, NT
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: 4 -- Sun, Mar 17 -- 10:00am MT
Delorey Final
Koe (5)
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Canadian mixed doubles championship starts in Fredericton on Sunday

Canadian mixed doubles championship starts in Fredericton on Sunday

Marlee Powers and Luke Saunders of Halifax, Nova Scotia won 6-5 over Papley/van Amsterdam in the opening draw streamed on Curling Canada's Plus platform.

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