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05-29-16 06:49PM
tuck is offline Click Here to See the Profile for tuck Click here to Send tuck a Private Message Find more posts by tuck Add tuck to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
tuck
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Women's will be a far tougher nut to crack. Coming up with "chemistry" requires that each player accepts their role and that players (at a minimum) don't dislike their teammates.

It all begins at skip. Here chemistry demands a leader and it's difficult to lead if you don't have a relationship with those being led.

Absent past skips that were proven at the World Women's level (Erika, Patti Lank, Cassie Johnson Potter, et alia), we are left with the yet-unproven. Some people of a more negative mindset might suggest that some of these have already had their chance are have been proven to be lacking. I would disagree, but I'd also have to concede that they may be right.

Nina and Jamie did most of the skipping last year. Aileen has done some. Monica Walker may have earned a chance. Alex Carlson is the new face.

I can't say that any of them excite me after the last two years. I also think all of them might turn into a World Women's level skip...maybe.

That leaves us the Juniors. Cory might be our next Olympic skip. I'd lean towards Sarah. Yes, Sarah's shooting has slightly declined the last two years...but I think that can be overcome. I like a skip where the front end would walk through fire for her. Most of the good ones have that. I think Sarah has that.

Also interesting will be which coach goes with which team. I FIRMLY BELIEVE THAT TEAMS SHOULD CHOOSE THE COACH AND NOT HAVE ONE ASSIGNED. With the retirement of Wally Henry, we now have just Dave Jensen as a proven winner. It will be very, very interesting to see which teams get him as a coach.

I'm not close enough to the situation to know which curler likes or dislikes another curler, so I won't even try to make teams out of the selected. Again, I become repetitive but the days are changing. As staff can shuffle the lineups whenever they wish, setting lineups in May isn't very important.

Ben Tucker

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05-29-16 08:39PM
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misty1
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why no erika brown? kind of surprised none of that team made it..or maybe im missing something and they didnt last year either. still, they are the best womens team in the US right now so...

or did i maybe miss a retirement announcement

kind of surprised plys is still there. they have put a lot of faith in him for no pay out at all. he was a brilliant junior but 7 years on and he's still yet to make a mark on the pro level

Last edited by misty1 on 05-29-16 at 08:41PM

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05-29-16 09:05PM
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IMWright
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quote:
Originally posted by misty1
why no erika brown? kind of surprised none of that team made it..or maybe im missing something and they didnt last year either. still, they are the best womens team in the US right now so...

or did i maybe miss a retirement announcement

kind of surprised plys is still there. they have put a lot of faith in him for no pay out at all. he was a brilliant junior but 7 years on and he's still yet to make a mark on the pro level



That's why I was wondering if Erika Brown (or Brady Clark on the mens side) A: applied to the combine, and B: were at the combine? If they didn't, ok, they decided not to. But if they did.... Ummm....

Regarding Plys, yeah. For how fickle the powers that be are in who's in and who's out, seems surprising that Plys is still in...

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05-29-16 10:52PM
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SmokeyJoe
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For reasons of national security, the names of those participating in the combine cannot be released. Seriously, it appears that Gerry has become a shill for the HPP.

What could be the reason for secrecy? I can only speculate with what if's and maybe's,. What if last year's champions participated in the combine and were not invited to become part of the HPP? A sh*t storm for sure.

Especially with the format for qualifying for the Olympic Trials. Unless you are part of the HPP, the deck is stacked overwhelmingly against you. You would have to outperform funded teams from the HPP, and then finish in the top 5 in the world to qualify for the Olympic Trials.

Extremely difficult for a non-HPP team, but achievable for an HPP team. The thee HPP teams are guaranteed a spot in the Olympic Trials. A Herculean effort will be required by any other teams to get into the trials.

Membership in the USCA used to provide members the opportunity to represent the US in Men's, Women's, Junior Men's, and Junior Women's championships. Those opportunities have been taken away. Makes you wonder why it still makes sense to belong to the USCA.

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05-30-16 01:07AM
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Curlrock
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SmokingJoe, I addressed the rationale for the USCA to be involved in "high performance" curling. No one wanted to discuss that. Maybe it's a topic for another thread. Maybe I'm just crazy. To me the USCA has become minions to the USOC in all things pertaining to competitive curling. Sorry, but that's the way I see it.

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05-30-16 02:03AM
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Grat
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I'm assuming Brady Clark and Erica Brown's teams did not apply for the HPP. The reasons could be geography and time constraints or wanting to keep their lineups intact and maintain control of their teams.

The important thing is that there is not an adversarial relationship between the HPP program and non-HPP teams, and the HPP staff is willing to offer support and advice to the non-HPP athletes.

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05-30-16 11:02AM
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curlky
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quote:
Originally posted by SPMFromPCC


That is correct. It was edited by Gerry without my consent. The post wasn't up ten minutes and he sent me a PM on Facebook telling me so.



Since the man wont let you post who was cut from the HPP, how about listing people who were not even at the combine. Most people in this thread would like to know if Erika's team or Brady's team were there.

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05-30-16 01:28PM
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tuck
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Erika's team did not apply and were not there, from what I've heard. One is expecting a child. Erika is contemplating not doing competitive curling. To the best of my knowledge, the HPP did not reach out to Allison Peanut Pottinger. This could be a mistake; but (as they've shown before) they can reach out midseason like they did with Beighton and Smitty.

Brady's team was all there. None of the four were invited to join the HPP. I struggle with that, but I chose to believe (for the time being) that the HPP staff had very good reasons. Right now, such reasons escape me.

Let's stop crucifying Gerry on his own site. I've met him and talked with him. He's a nice guy. If he edited The Punk's post without The Punk's knowledge, then I'm sure it was to spare hard feelings and embarrassment of those that didn't make it. Yes, he can sometimes stand behind the HPP and USCA when all logic and evidence suggest otherwise and they do hire him to run stats and stuff...but he is neither an ass nor a dictator. I've met him. I think was out of line on this one. I think he's a great guy.

Methinks that a name or two on the HPP list could be there mostly for Mixed Doubles. They seem to have more bodies than they need and a couple of the names only really make sense if you look at Mixed Doubles and its Olympic Medal Status.

Ben Tucker

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05-30-16 04:12PM
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misty1
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quote:
Originally posted by tuck
Erika's team did not apply and were not there, from what I've heard. One is expecting a child. Erika is contemplating not doing competitive curling. To the best of my knowledge, the HPP did not reach out to Allison Peanut Pottinger. This could be a mistake; but (as they've shown before) they can reach out midseason like they did with Beighton and Smitty.

Brady's team was all there. None of the four were invited to join the HPP. I struggle with that, but I chose to believe (for the time being) that the HPP staff had very good reasons. Right now, such reasons escape me.

Let's stop crucifying Gerry on his own site. I've met him and talked with him. He's a nice guy. If he edited The Punk's post without The Punk's knowledge, then I'm sure it was to spare hard feelings and embarrassment of those that didn't make it. Yes, he can sometimes stand behind the HPP and USCA when all logic and evidence suggest otherwise and they do hire him to run stats and stuff...but he is neither an ass nor a dictator. I've met him. I think was out of line on this one. I think he's a great guy.

Methinks that a name or two on the HPP list could be there mostly for Mixed Doubles. They seem to have more bodies than they need and a couple of the names only really make sense if you look at Mixed Doubles and its Olympic Medal Status.

Ben Tucker



okay thanks. just would seem strange to me not to invite them if they are were there but now that i know erika and her team werent there then that explains it.

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05-30-16 05:27PM
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jamcan
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Athletes get cut from teams, pro and amateur, all the time and their names aren't withheld. Nor, to the best of my knowledge has any professional or amateur team, association or governing body asked the press not to publish who didn't make the cut for fear of 'embarrassment. Whether I agree with your selection process or not is moot here.

What is a more serious issue, is this website censoring a post, without the authors permission. It's one thing if the post is promoting hatred,violence etc. But over something that is a common practice in almost every other sport in the world?


I do not for one minute buy the embarrassment argument. People try out for a spot and either get it or not. It's a simple part of the game. You might be disappointed in not making the top group, but no one would be so distraught they would demand the names of everyone who failed weren't published.

The only logical conclusion is there is something else at work here.

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05-30-16 07:26PM
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curlky
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tuck, I am not trying to throw Gerry under teh bus. I apprecaite all he does, and have no issue if he edited teh post and took away the info. I wanted to know if anyone frmo Erikas team or Bradys team were there. Outside of that, I dont think there were any that were all that surprising.

As for whomever just posted that they have an issue with Gerry censoring a post. I am not even going to waste the time to scroll down and check who that was. But this is Gerry's site, he can do with it as he pleases. You don't like it, please don't come back. Anything you post here is subject to editing by an admin with no reason necessary. You want your freedom of the press, start your own site.

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05-30-16 07:56PM
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misty1
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i will say that gerry seems to be pretty lenient with whats allowed on here so if he felt the need to edit a post there had to be a darn good reason for it

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05-30-16 09:14PM
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curlinglove
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I'm just here to talk about the new athletes in the High Performance Program.

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05-30-16 10:17PM
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Grat
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I'm here for the free donuts.

I would love to have seen Brady's team added and funded, but I can think of a few reasons for not bringing Brady's team into the program. First is not having room for the whole team and not wanting to break up the team. Another is proximity to the coaches and training center.

Without looking at budgets from year to year, it's possible that the milestones that were reached in the first year increased funding and made it uniquely possible to grow the program and add Shuster's team in whole, and each player judged individually may have been worthy among the players who applied last year.

Last edited by Grat on 05-30-16 at 10:46PM

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05-30-16 10:57PM
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curlky
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quote:
Originally posted by Grat
Another is proximity to the coaches and training center


Ive often thought that Brady being in Washington works against him being int he HPP. 3 people in WA and one in AK really would make it far more expensive to fund that team than the teams that live a drive away from the training center and many of the Canadian tour events. Not sure if I think it is a great sole reason, but I think that it would be fair to consider it as a small reason amongst many others, including the fact that Clarks team is not super young

Last edited by curlky on 05-30-16 at 10:59PM

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05-30-16 11:41PM
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tuck
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Geography? Age? Um...no. Heck no.

Brady is the same age as Craig and younger than Heater.

Is Washington DC better than Washington State? Is Seattle worse than Boston? There are lots of selected HPP curler who live very far from Blaine. Isn't Beighton still living in Seattle?

If we are going to play "Guess Why The HPP Didn't Select The Gold Medalists", let's at least make reasonable guesses.

Ben Tucker

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05-31-16 03:03AM
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curlinglove
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It is hard to imagine geography being an issue due to the fact that there are two athletes from Alaska, plus one from Seattle on the adult HPP teams. And there is one athlete from Alaska and two from Washington on the junior HPP teams.

Although I first thought geography would be an issue because I think it would be more difficult to form solid team chemistry when you see your teammates just at select camps and tournaments.

Also, I imagine the frequent travel would put a toll on the juniors' school. Good on them though for making the team.

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05-31-16 10:02AM
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biterbar
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quote:
Originally posted by SPMFromPCC
The list of daily athletes participating was publicly posted in multiple places throughout the club, including just inside the main door on the glass overlooking the ice. This makes it public domain. It wasn't as though I went snooping around anywhere for anything.

Next.



Public information. This stinks to high heaven. The lack of transparency in the HP Program is disheartening.

The fact this was released at 4:30 on a Friday of a major holiday weekend goes to show how opaque they are trying to be. Public Relations 101 teaches this is the worst time (Friday, late afternoon, holiday) to do it to reach your audience. It should have been released 10:00 this morning.

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05-31-16 11:21AM
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IceMelter
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Wow... Could Brown actually be making even more of a joke out of US curling??? to sum up this thread...

Team Brady, the team that dominated US nationals last year, did not get one player selected to the HPP Program? This is absurd especially considering some of the names on there that have never placed higher than fourth... Or teams that haven't won

Murray posts information that was posted in a public restaurant... yet was censored as that was supposed to be private information?

At least Brown is still earning his paycheck lol

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05-31-16 11:31AM
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SPMFromPCC
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quote:
Originally posted by tuck
Erika's team did not apply and were not there, from what I've heard. One is expecting a child. Erika is contemplating not doing competitive curling. To the best of my knowledge, the HPP did not reach out to Allison Peanut Pottinger. This could be a mistake; but (as they've shown before) they can reach out midseason like they did with Beighton and Smitty.

Brady's team was all there. None of the four were invited to join the HPP. I struggle with that, but I chose to believe (for the time being) that the HPP staff had very good reasons. Right now, such reasons escape me.

Ben Tucker



My own second-hand understanding about Erika is that she asked for her entire team to be accepted into the program, which was rejected. She then declined to participate.

Tuck is correct about Brady's team with one exception; Colin was not in Blaine and to my knowledge didn't participate. Brady, Greg, and Phil all were there however.

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05-31-16 01:53PM
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Grat
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I don't think you can read much into Colin not being there because the combine was for players not in the HPP.

As for geography being a factor, I don't know how much time the current players are spending in Blaine, and if some of the players not in the HPP just can't be there as much due to jobs, family, and all that other life stuff.

We also don't know if invitations were extended to any individuals who may have turned them down instead of breaking up their team.

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05-31-16 06:59PM
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Harvey Hacksmasher

 

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Is it known yet what coach is assigned to each team in HPP? Should we expect the same coach for the same teams? Drobnick with the men, etc.

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05-31-16 09:40PM
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curlky
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I think not only are the coaches not known, the actual teams have not yet been announced.

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05-31-16 10:01PM
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peglegg
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isn't the idea to curl in Canada? I'll have to check with Sarah Palin but I think you can see Alberta from Seattle.
Tuck quit defending Guertz -- he does a ton but what he did this time was wrong.

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05-31-16 10:37PM
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Grat
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The purpose of the world qualification system is for all teams to curl more in Canada.

Part of the philosophy of the HPP is a coach-centric approach to curling teams.

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