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M: USA Curling Junior National Championships
Eau Claire, WI
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Draw: M7 -- Thu, Mar 28 -- 8:00pm CT
Lannoye Final
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W: USA Curling Junior National Championships
Eau Claire, WI
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M: Canadian Mixed Doubles Curling Championship
Fredericton, NB
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Draw: CF -- Fri, Mar 22 -- 1:00pm AT
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M: Swiss Junior Championships
Thun, SUI
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Caccivio Final
Brauchli 12  (EE)
Dryburgh Final
Ringgenberg (9)
W: Swiss Junior Championships
Thun, SUI
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Schwaller Final
Oberson (9)
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von Arx (9)
W: NWTCA Curling Club Championships
Fort Smith, NT
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Draw: 3 -- Sat, Mar 23 -- 11:00am MT
Stroeder Final
Delorey (7)
M: NWTCA Curling Club Championships
Fort Smith, NT
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Draw: 3 -- Sat, Mar 23 -- 1:00pm ET
Delorey Final
Lockhart (EE)
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12-11-14 12:04PM
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Netz
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WCT - Triple KO

Finally they got it right, a round robin in the WCT does not work, or for that matter the OCT also.

Looking forward to it and let's find way to make it the norm.

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12-11-14 02:57PM
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Sportsnet had a "Slam Summit" in July where a lot of the top men's and women's teams were brought in to discuss the direction of GS events moving forward. One of the items the players' agreed upon was trying to give each Slam an identity, similar to the 4 majors in golf. So I don't think you should expect a triple knock-out format across the board. I like the differences myself.

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12-12-14 01:06AM
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If the final goes to 3 games, will Sportsnet clear that much time? If so, they'd better have at least six hours of darts or snooker, "just in case".

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12-12-14 09:48AM
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Shawzy
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quote:
Originally posted by Jimbobogie
If the final goes to 3 games, will Sportsnet clear that much time? If so, they'd better have at least six hours of darts or snooker, "just in case".


The final won't go to 3 games because the playoffs are a straight QF-SF-F bracket with the side you qualify out of only determining your seeding for the playoffs. No matter how you qualify it's a win or go home game.

In any case, I think 16 teams is way too few for a triple knockout bonspiel. You need at least 24 in my opinion.

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12-12-14 10:17AM
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curlingmad
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quote:
Originally posted by Shawzy


The final won't go to 3 games because the playoffs are a straight QF-SF-F bracket with the side you qualify out of only determining your seeding for the playoffs. No matter how you qualify it's a win or go home game.

In any case, I think 16 teams is way too few for a triple knockout bonspiel. You need at least 24 in my opinion.



You make a very good point in that 16 teams is too few for a TKO but then again do the organizers really care about the curlers.

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12-12-14 03:37PM
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quote:
Originally posted by curlingmad


You make a very good point in that 16 teams is too few for a TKO but then again do the organizers really care about the curlers.



If you're a curler in one of these events you'd have to be thrilled that half the teams that enter qualify for the playoffs (and thus get more money and points). If you can win one of your first two games you've got a shot at qualifying and you don't have to navigate four banana-skin games on the C-side against teams that are just making up the numbers (and thus represent opportunities to switch off mentally).

My issue is that this just reinforces the idea that Grand Slams are just points giveaways for those that qualify. If you're going to give points and money to 15 or 16 teams you might as well make them fight for it instead of letting them show up, go 1-3 or 1-4, and then take home some points. The last thing I want to see is teams getting rewarded for crappy weeks just because they qualified for the bonspiel. And having half the teams in the playoffs just reeks of the same thing.

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12-12-14 08:21PM
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Gerry
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Don't have time for more teams in the event. It already starts Tuesday with 4 draws a day. 16 Men's teams and 16 Women's teams is the most that can be done at this point.

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12-13-14 10:25AM
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Borough Boy
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quote:
Originally posted by Shawzy


If you're a curler in one of these events you'd have to be thrilled that half the teams that enter qualify for the playoffs (and thus get more money and points). If you can win one of your first two games you've got a shot at qualifying and you don't have to navigate four banana-skin games on the C-side against teams that are just making up the numbers (and thus represent opportunities to switch off mentally).

My issue is that this just reinforces the idea that Grand Slams are just points giveaways for those that qualify. If you're going to give points and money to 15 or 16 teams you might as well make them fight for it instead of letting them show up, go 1-3 or 1-4, and then take home some points. The last thing I want to see is teams getting rewarded for crappy weeks just because they qualified for the bonspiel. And having half the teams in the playoffs just reeks of the same thing.





Once again, I don't get this "giveaway points" argument.

Here is how you "qualify"

Seventeen teams are invited to the National based on the World Curling Tour’s order of merit.

The Grand Slam of Curling reserves the right to allocate one sponsor exemption for this event. This may or may not be implemented.

If any team declines an invite, the Grand Slam of Curling continues down the OOM list

Umm, pretty clear to me that there is no gift here. Now, take a minute and review the field at the other cash spiels this week that in your estimate are, earning points. Truro Cash spiel, name me one team in that event that even remotely comes close to the quality of the mens field at the Grand Slam. One win against any of those grand slam teams has to be worth more, end of story. Lots more. I don't know who would you rahter face to qualigy, Johnny Mo or Ian Fitzner Leblanc?

This line of argument is so far off its not even funny anymore. Play better, move up the oom and get in a slam, plain and simple.

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12-13-14 02:31PM
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Shawzy
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quote:
Originally posted by Borough Boy




Once again, I don't get this "giveaway points" argument.

Here is how you "qualify"

Seventeen teams are invited to the National based on the World Curling Tour’s order of merit.

The Grand Slam of Curling reserves the right to allocate one sponsor exemption for this event. This may or may not be implemented.

If any team declines an invite, the Grand Slam of Curling continues down the OOM list

Umm, pretty clear to me that there is no gift here. Now, take a minute and review the field at the other cash spiels this week that in your estimate are, earning points. Truro Cash spiel, name me one team in that event that even remotely comes close to the quality of the mens field at the Grand Slam. One win against any of those grand slam teams has to be worth more, end of story. Lots more. I don't know who would you rahter face to qualigy, Johnny Mo or Ian Fitzner Leblanc?

This line of argument is so far off its not even funny anymore. Play better, move up the oom and get in a slam, plain and simple.



The argument is that you shouldn't be awarded points and money for just showing up, which is exactly what happens when 15/16 or 17/18 teams in a bonspiel get points and money (i.e. the last two Grand Slams). How you qualify is fine, but you can't tell me that a team who loses more games than they win, regardless of the opposition, deserves any points at all (not even to bring other spiels into the question).

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12-13-14 06:02PM
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Ah you are right, let's make sure that we don't market our best players and teams and try to make our stars household names.

We need to insure a spiel has 32 teams to make sure a c qualifier has more wins than loss, regardless of quality of teams. And it really should be the objective of a slam to have bigger fields than quality fields. I mean the pga has invitational events and majors where you need to qualify, but they shouldn't count the same because of the lower amount of players, after all who would want to win the masters, imagine the stigma!, I'd much prefer to win the canadian open because of the full field.

I would suggest we call this new slam concept the portage la prairie cash spiel, oh hold on, we have events like that already that play for lower purses ,no tv and no fan fare but hey, that c qualifier sure is satisfied because they had more wins than loses!

You are totally ignoring the strength for field component. Ps if you go no wins in a slam you get no points and no money.

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12-13-14 06:27PM
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jamcan
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This set-up is the kind of example the WCT should have been making long ago. For three reasons:

First, the TKO is preferred by players and far more dramatic for fans than a Pool Spiel. No meaningless games, no tiebreakers, easy and quicker to run. But I agree that it should be at least 24 teams in a Slam, not 16 or fewer.

Second, this event gets it right by paying half the field. Its time, regardless of the number of teams in an event, that we paid 50% of the entrants prize money. How many pro golfers would there be in the PGA if only 25% of the field made the cut? Not many.

Third, the finals are on a Sunday, not a Monday so spectators can see all the qualifiers (Friday and Saturday) plus all the playoffs.

This is the way all the cashspiels have to start going. More teams making money, events running Thursday-Sunday.

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12-13-14 09:59PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Borough Boy
Ah you are right, let's make sure that we don't market our best players and teams and try to make our stars household names.

We need to insure a spiel has 32 teams to make sure a c qualifier has more wins than loss, regardless of quality of teams. And it really should be the objective of a slam to have bigger fields than quality fields. I mean the pga has invitational events and majors where you need to qualify, but they shouldn't count the same because of the lower amount of players, after all who would want to win the masters, imagine the stigma!, I'd much prefer to win the canadian open because of the full field.

I would suggest we call this new slam concept the portage la prairie cash spiel, oh hold on, we have events like that already that play for lower purses ,no tv and no fan fare but hey, that c qualifier sure is satisfied because they had more wins than loses!

You are totally ignoring the strength for field component. Ps if you go no wins in a slam you get no points and no money.



I'm not ignoring the strength of field at all. I've never argued that the teams that win should get the points that they do. But you can't argue that a team that loses more than they win deserves anything at all. The concept makes no sense and I'm not going to argue with you any more if you can't grasp that simple concept.

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12-13-14 10:21PM
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decade
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quote:
Originally posted by jamcan
This set-up is the kind of example the WCT should have been making long ago. For three reasons:

First, the TKO is preferred by players and far more dramatic for fans than a Pool Spiel. No meaningless games, no tiebreakers, easy and quicker to run. But I agree that it should be at least 24 teams in a Slam, not 16 or fewer.

Second, this event gets it right by paying half the field. Its time, regardless of the number of teams in an event, that we paid 50% of the entrants prize money. How many pro golfers would there be in the PGA if only 25% of the field made the cut? Not many.

Third, the finals are on a Sunday, not a Monday so spectators can see all the qualifiers (Friday and Saturday) plus all the playoffs.

This is the way all the cashspiels have to start going. More teams making money, events running Thursday-Sunday.


But would it be possible to run a male /female combined event like the canada open with 24 teams, only 5 sheets and still only use thurs to fri?

Last edited by decade on 12-13-14 at 10:24PM

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12-13-14 10:30PM
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Gerry
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quote:
Originally posted by decade

But would it be possible to run a male /female combined event like the canada open with 24 teams, only 5 sheets and still only use thurs to fri?



No. We currently do two 16-team triples and the event already starts on Tuesday. 5 sheets with 4 draws a day.

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12-14-14 11:13AM
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Borough Boy
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quote:
Originally posted by Shawzy


I'm not ignoring the strength of field at all. I've never argued that the teams that win should get the points that they do. But you can't argue that a team that loses more than they win deserves anything at all. The concept makes no sense and I'm not going to argue with you any more if you can't grasp that simple concept.



No the concept isn't the simple one here( wink wink))NAND yes you are totally ignoring the strength of field at a slam, not sure how on earth you can make that statement

Go look at chad Stevens record so far in Truro, now look at John Morris for example. Johnny mo beat quality teams, chad Stevens wouldn't win a toaster beating those teams at a London highlands point spiel!

So yes I get what you are saying the problem is you are disagreeing with, well me and the players and the cca and well, pretty much everyone .

The fact that the slams award points based on the quality of opponent is different than the old days but then again, the slams were designed and marketed to bring the best vs best.

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Curling Scores

M: USA Curling Junior National Championships
Eau Claire, WI
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: M7 -- Thu, Mar 28 -- 8:00pm CT
Lannoye Final
Hebert (10) Watch Live Curling!
Fitzgerald Final
Cenzalli (10) Watch Live Curling!
Brenden Final
Church (9) Watch Live Curling!
Guentzel Final
Rose (6) Watch Live Curling!
W: USA Curling Junior National Championships
Eau Claire, WI
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: W6 -- Thu, Mar 28 -- 4:00pm CT
Berg Final
Scheel (10) Watch Live Curling!
Berg Final
Schapman (10) Watch Live Curling!
Giroux 10  Final
Pekowitz (9) Watch Live Curling!
Viau Final
Johnson (10) Watch Live Curling!
M: Canadian Mixed Doubles Curling Championship
Fredericton, NB
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: CF -- Fri, Mar 22 -- 1:00pm AT
Lott/Lott Final
Walk/Muyr (8) Watch Live Curling!
M: Swiss Junior Championships
Thun, SUI
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: CF2 -- Sun, Mar 24 -- 3:00am ET
Caccivio Final
Brauchli 12  (EE)
Dryburgh Final
Ringgenberg (9)
W: Swiss Junior Championships
Thun, SUI
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: CF2 -- Sun, Mar 24 -- 9:00am CET
Schwaller Final
Oberson (9)
Blackham Final
von Arx (9)
W: NWTCA Curling Club Championships
Fort Smith, NT
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: 3 -- Sat, Mar 23 -- 11:00am MT
Stroeder Final
Delorey (7)
M: NWTCA Curling Club Championships
Fort Smith, NT
Teams | Scores | Standings | Playoffs
Draw: 3 -- Sat, Mar 23 -- 1:00pm ET
Delorey Final
Lockhart (EE)
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