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03-05-19 11:32AM
jamcan is offline Click Here to See the Profile for jamcan Click here to Send jamcan a Private Message Find more posts by jamcan Add jamcan to your buddy list Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
jamcan
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Two possible great stories developing here. Two big underdogs are in position to advance to the championship pool and show why this new format is horribly flawed.

In the much tougher Pool A, Jon Solberg sits at 2-2 with a major upset of Manitoba in his back pocket. Win this morning against Team Pity Berth and they could slip into a tiebreaker with a potential 4-3 record.

In the much weaker Pool B, NS sits at 3-1 and could've been 4-0 except for a minor miscue against BC. They have tough opponents left but an upset is highly possible for them to also reach 4-3 and then find a tiebreaker.

Herein lies the problem with the two pool format (apart from the obvious that 3 teams should not even be in the Brier). Neither Solberg nor Thompson get the opportunity to play the rest of the field and better their overall records.

Sure it's a longshot, but teams at 3-4 have rallied to 7-4 and won Briers (1985 boys and girls). Plus playing and beating the entire field is a much truer test of your teams abilities and talent.

It's also a better feel good story then watching what is now deteriorating into just another slam with the same boring faces.

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03-05-19 01:02PM
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disagree with some should not be in brier

its a national championship

they earn their way - the pros generally win but sometimes their is a regular team that gets hot - like in the provincials - its good for popularizing curling at all levels - 90% of televised brier games are the pros - by thurs 99%

brier problem is too little depth - koe gushue , canada , cotter , mcewen , martin, howard , ferbey, stoughton , ns , nb, jacobs etc etc have been representing the provinces for 20-25 years ----

same with worlds edin, trulsen, germany 25 yrs , etc etc
- i acknowledge they are the best

- i acknowledge that brady and patriots are too

tiger was

federer , connor was

but that doesnt help grow the sport - like silly commercials it likely hurts more than helps

except fo tv ratings - almighty $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

my solution is simple

like that tried and talked about rule about losing last rock if you blank

if you qualify for brier two years - you are subject to tem limits - you are not eligible for next 2 years .... and this will encourage new blood

similarly if announcers make 50 mistakes in a brier they are entitled to a year off -


why did myre draw down behind his shot rock instaed of putting it on tee to right ??

i havent curled for for 40 years but i think most skips make a few odd calls - that cost them the end and sometimes the game -

i enjoyed last night but couldnt bring myself to watch this morning

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03-05-19 02:28PM
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Island Roger
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quote:
Originally posted by fresca
A thought curl canada

Instead of running essentially useless ads - everyone watching is a devoted curler - so a better idea would be running it at 8am when cartoon fillers are on

Or

There are 350 scott volunteers and probably 500 brier volunteers in Brandon

ALL unpaid for about 50 hours each - plus they pay $125 ish for a volunteer jacket that im guessing costs $15

Give the volunteers a jacket and pay them $1 an hour and dont run silly commercials

Then we get to see the lead rocks in our national championship



FYI ... the Volunteer Fee is designed to weed out the volunteers that are not serious about contributing in a positive manner as well as cover any costs associated (Uniforms, Meals etc). They aren't making any money of it that's for sure.

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03-05-19 02:50PM
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quote:
Originally posted by fresca
disagree with some should not be in brier

its a national championship

they earn their way - the pros generally win but sometimes their is a regular team that gets hot - like in the provincials - its good for popularizing curling at all levels - 90% of televised brier games are the pros - by thurs 99%

brier problem is too little depth - koe gushue , canada , cotter , mcewen , martin, howard , ferbey, stoughton , ns , nb, jacobs etc etc have been representing the provinces for 20-25 years ----

same with worlds edin, trulsen, germany 25 yrs , etc etc
- i acknowledge they are the best

- i acknowledge that brady and patriots are too

tiger was

federer , connor was

but that doesnt help grow the sport - like silly commercials it likely hurts more than helps

except fo tv ratings - almighty $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

my solution is simple

like that tried and talked about rule about losing last rock if you blank

if you qualify for brier two years - you are subject to tem limits - you are not eligible for next 2 years .... and this will encourage new blood

similarly if announcers make 50 mistakes in a brier they are entitled to a year off -


why did myre draw down behind his shot rock instaed of putting it on tee to right ??

i havent curled for for 40 years but i think most skips make a few odd calls - that cost them the end and sometimes the game -

i enjoyed last night but couldnt bring myself to watch this morning



One team representing YK/NWT/NUN and no Pity Berth for losing rich teams.

That makes it 13 teams, one RR against all and a level playing field.

Corporate Sponsor and TV Executives as 'Stakeholders'? They get their games, advertising and cheap commercials. They have zero business telling us how to run the event or who plays in it.

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03-05-19 02:55PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Island Roger


FYI ... the Volunteer Fee is designed to weed out the volunteers that are not serious about contributing in a positive manner as well as cover any costs associated (Uniforms, Meals etc). They aren't making any money of it that's for sure.



Yeah, yeah. Heard that argument before and it's crap. It's coloring the entire volunteer work force because of the actions of a very few and it's lazy management.

In fact, it's the same reasoning used to stir up anti-union sentiments. Truth is there are just as many puppy-pounding managers/supervisors/non-union staff as there are union ones. Ask anyone with experience in both environments and they'll tell you the same.

Got a volunteer that just shows up, heads to the patch to drink and watch games? Don't be lazy. Take them aside, tell them to get working or strip them of their accreditation and uniform and boot them out. You'll be rid of a problem and earn the respect of those volunteers who are actually working.

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03-05-19 03:32PM
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i was kind of making a joke - it was whine about not showing lead rocks

the volunteers are fabulous and likely dont mind paying the $125

tims and scotties have been supplying coffee and treats for 100 years -

without volunteers there would be no brier or scot or mixed or juniors etc etc and certainly no bonspiels in clubs and towns

One died this week in Winnipeg

Judge Gordon McTavish 94

in the 50s he would teach many 11 year old boys at the Granite every Saturday .... often arranging for them to spare in the mens 1 and 3 pm sat draw before the junior draw at that another volunteer - Lloyd Borland supervised for 20 years

1000s like these across canada

if the vegas casino are arguing about supplying ice for free they are obviously not getting enough curlers there - and most are FAR from gamblers or big spenders - they dont need the curlers that gamble and lose $200 in a week and stay in a room for a week, eat $15 steak and lobster , and 16 games for $800 - so that continental cup is in trouble there

tv crews are expensive and im guessing announcers cost $2mil a year - so far we have lost a lot of sponsors in 60 years - luck to have new holland, pioneer, world f g , bestwestern, allianz, home hardware, monsanto , scotties , ford , tims , chicken chef , qualico and all the others cause curlers wont pay much - certainly not enough

as for singling out one team thats spoiling your brier - thats a little sad - pappy from nunavuit has been on two 5 second highlight clips and made both draws to the 4 btw

suck it up buttercup - start watching thursday - the other 1.5 mil can handle it


as for botcher s wild card - couldnt happen to a nicer guy - best shooter out there - cool as a cucumber - with a great team - playing by the rules - cud easily play out of nunavvuit or bc - but doesnt - has koe to beat every year .. if anyone deserves a wc shot its him , or john , - hope they win the brier

Last edited by fresca on 03-05-19 at 04:39PM

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03-05-19 04:55PM
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Bottcher & Team Nice-Guys will be around on the weekend; pretty convinced of that.

Brendan is a marvellous young shooter at 26/27, paid his dues, making his shots, absorbs the philosophy and strategy of the game, never gets over-wrought (like Fry or McEwen) and keeps making shots, tormenting all comers.

Remember, when Ernie Richardson first won a Brier he was only 28 or so (1959), Terry Braunstein was only 18 when he coughed up his first trip to pneumonia-infested Matt Baldwin in 1958, won the duke in his final trip to the Brier starting gate in 1965 (at age 27)

Kerri Burtnyk only 22 when he stole the Brier from Alan Hackner in Halifax '81.

You almost have to be a combination of Sigmund Freud, Bobby Fisher & Ken Watson to outsmart and outcurt (especially outsmart) the super curlers like Koe, Gushue, Jacobs these days; especially in this era of shot-stacking clusters!

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03-05-19 05:18PM
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this macdonald guy from ontario might as well just carry the rock down and plunk it where he wants it -

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03-05-19 05:24PM
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Manitoba Legend
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quote:
Originally posted by fresca
this macdonald guy from ontario might as well just carry the rock down and plunk it where he wants it -


He's a gooder as they say!

Too bad he can't carry his remaining 3 rinkmates like he does his own stones.

He'll be an enormously tough out for the FINAL 4 - but experience may be their #1 undoing. . . . . I think he's gonna torment the hay out of one of the 4-pak of monsters (Koe, Goo, Jacobs, Bottcher) for the 4th spot.

McEwen & Mr. Muyres will both yield standing ovations when they eventually bow out!

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03-05-19 05:34PM
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Jamcan, I figure pool 'A' is about 9% "tougher" than pool 'B'. Is that what you were referring to?

Only reason I ask is because there were umpteen women's events in September, October and November, 2018 that make this percentage difference seem pint-sized by comparison.

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03-05-19 06:15PM
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if you look at the top 3 teams in pool a

and compare to top 3 teams in b

ml and you can play in b

my best chance at a brier is A

representing the north west angle when it becomes a province , curling out of the Echo Bay Curling and Sailing Club with my high school team

and if im honest i prob wont emerge from either pool

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03-05-19 07:18PM
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So long as Magic Mikey splits his final 2 games - he should be able to wobble into the Round of 8 before encountering superior opposition and bowing out.

McEwen pitted up against the Sioux City Thug Squad tonite (Jacobs) so thats not great news. Should fall to 3-3 if Jacobs is on his normal game - Mike can't stand up to Jacobs - Reid definitely won't stand up to Fry.

If McEwen wins his final rr. game vs. PEI they should advance with a 4-3 record.

Jacobs & Bottcher should advance out of this pool quite easily with Sask'n & Manitoba being laggards.

Marty Crete (Que) needs to roll thru his final 2 games to cause a traffic jam (tie-breaker) for the 4th spot in the pool.

I'm sure Manitoba (and those great Brandon fans) don't have their hopes up too high with Mikey holding the keys to our province's low-horsepower vehicle.

4-3 in the first rd.
Maybe 1 win in the cross-pool
Final record - 5-5, sound familiar?

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03-05-19 09:39PM
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The love-in the announcers have with NO is so nauseating that the mute button was hit, 3 ends ago.

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03-05-19 09:53PM
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quote:
Originally posted by decade
The love-in the announcers have with NO is so nauseating that the mute button was hit, 3 ends ago.


The N. Ont. hit-men are pretty good dissecting a mediocre & totally distracted Manitoba team (story in itself, mediocrity of elite manitoba men's curling)

Jacobs is all focus-face, to be sure. But savaging a helpless mope like McEwen? A medal it isn't!

The real battles will be when the elites battle the elites - ie. Jacobs vs Gushue, Koe vs. Bottcher or somesuch. Everyone else is pretty much window-dressing til they take their final curtain calls!

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03-05-19 10:05PM
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quote:
Originally posted by decade
The love-in the announcers have with NO is so nauseating that the mute button was hit, 3 ends ago.


Agreed. Also dislike their biased fawning over Bottcher and Gushue. They also wrote off Koe after the first end in the Koe v Gushue battle.

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03-05-19 10:15PM
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quote:
Originally posted by MeaghanEdwards


Agreed. Also dislike their biased fawning over Bottcher and Gushue. They also wrote off Koe after the first end in the Koe v Gushue battle.



Koe has the most unique ability to look like a helpless fawn who's totally disinterested into a poisonous viper at the turn of a hat. TSN announcers should know this - by now!

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03-05-19 11:19PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Deliverer
Jamcan, I figure pool 'A' is about 9% "tougher" than pool 'B'. Is that what you were referring to?

Only reason I ask is because there were umpteen women's events in September, October and November, 2018 that make this percentage difference seem pint-sized by comparison.



Consider this: heading into tomorrow the possibility exists of 4 teams tying at 3-4 for the last playoff berth from pool B. True, surprises and perceived upsets seem longshots but it can happen.

And look over at Pool A as Solberg just refuses to go away. I'm hoping the crowd in Brandon gets behind these guys in tomorrow's game against Jacobs.

Everyone loves an underdog!

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03-06-19 06:50AM
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we've seen this whole story with jacobs before. they look unbteatable, they look in the zone. they're making everything and making it look easy and the commentators are drooling and falling all over them.

however once the playoffs come they stumble. only once have they finished a brier off. that was in 2013 and, ironically enough that was when they took the most losses in the round robin and had to go through the 3 v.s 4 game.

2015 they went 10-1 in the round robin then lost the final

2016 they went 11-0 then settled for bronze

then of course in 2017 and last year they lost the 3 v.s 4 game

so lets wait and see how they do when the playoffs come this year because their round robin record always tends to be great . its the playoffs where they fall short. just 5-5

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03-06-19 07:31AM
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You could say the same thing about team Gushue in the past... Until they strung together back to back Brier wins, with a potential 3rd on tap.

I would not prejudge or take team Jacobs lightly.

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03-06-19 09:45AM
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i actually know which team will win

- starting thurs the team that gets hot - as jacobs and koe so far

- the same team will get a few extra breaks - a few timely freezes , a few extra lucky run backs , as i call them ,

- and on sunday a timely draw to the pot

same as always

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03-06-19 09:50AM
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Nobody taking the Jake the Snake gang lightly. They're dusting people - McMeltdown was lucky to escape with his body parts intact last night.

Reid was absolutely demolished by Fry - Jake destroyed Mikey with relative ease.

Jake's front end superior to Colin & Derek.

Barring some team going nutso-gutso hot - FINAL 4 should be Koe, Gushue, Jake, Bottcher.

McEwen is a demoralized group. Sask'n still full of spirit but don't have the nuanced shots to match Top4. McDonald is the only team I would rank with any kind of chance to make a dent in the FINAL 4.

As for McEwen - its stunning how far the once-mighty have fallen. Nothing more than a sullen field-team now. No spirit, no sustained house pressure or nuanced shots. Just 2 skips trying to find a way not to explode in rage on each other.

Everyone said they were super sharp coming out of Manitoba. Whats that all about? They got blown out early - made a nice run but if the top squad in Manitoba are Gunner & Scottish Willy its not really a powerhouse province anymore. Certainly no super teams. The graduated juniors are still 1 or 2 yrs away from making a dent. Waiting for the next Jeff Stoughton - or even K Burtnyk.

Mel Logan put up a more spirited fight in the 1982 Brandon Brier - and Logan played with walking pneumonia, still made the playoffs before succumbing to superior curlers!

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03-06-19 10:04AM
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Brandon Brier Crowds

Looked at the CC website. So far no draw in Brandon has had a crowd over 4000. Many crowds announced around 3300, . . . w/ prolly no more than 2400 to 2600 in the stands at any one time.

This is devastating not just for Brandon. But for curling.

If you can't get 5000 out for the opening ceremonies, something is viciously wrong. Travel costs? Access to hotels? Mediocre local representative? All draws on TV? All of above? Some of above?

Anyways the lowest crowd announced was 2850. Which tells me there were anywhere from 2400 to 2650 full-week to partial week passes sold prior to the thing geting going.

Thats not a great sale by any means. Especially with 300 to 400 volunteers in the stands.

Brandon is one of the great hotbeds of curling. I can deliver that proviso with confidence because I played there, worked there, visited there many times, etc.

I know the playoff games especially the final 4 will have 4200 to 4500+ in the stands but the rest of the week has been a disappointment. Nobody will talk about it cuz its not Brier social behavior. Wait ti the books are done and a lower$$$ is presented to junior curling - thats the primary tell.

Perhaps Brandon will make a ton of money. Remember, they are selling a gob of sponsorships, rink advertising, program advertising, event & media sponsorship, special events, socials, dances, beer halls, mini-convention/flea market, etc.

Perhaps the new reality of curling events is lower crowd counts but much higher non-crowd money?

Is this a clarion call for other (bigger) markets. Will places like Winnipeg, Regina, Edmonton, Saskatoon, Regina, London, Halifax, Red Deer, etc. only have crowds of 5,000 to 6500 for evening draws.

Only thing I really like about Brandon's crowds - they're still putting 2500 to 3000 bums in the seats during morning draws. Show me another market that does that, Jim.

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03-06-19 01:04PM
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Terry nb

Is the skip
Others shut up pls

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03-06-19 02:54PM
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Terry was just part of the up close and personal in the patch. Really funny guy. Asked his what the team pregame ritual was like, he said, I do what I want!

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03-06-19 03:47PM
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Crowds

Not sure about the official attendance but we are on the opposite draw of MB and morning g draws about 1/3 full. Afternoon draws 2/3 full and evening 3/4 full.
Crowds are very knowledgeable and supportive.

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